Just think of this guy hitting the field with a second-turn Kaalia of the Vast swing (In Commander, of course). Third turn, you're dropping whatever answer you pulled in those 35 cards you drew with Grislebrand. Add that to the 10 you've drawn so far (Assuming either multiplayer or draw first - 7 opening hand plus 3 for your 3 turns), and you're holding almost half your deck in your hand. Pop a CHildren of Korlis in the deck and you have ANOTHER 35 cards (We're up to 75 cards in hand here. On turn 3.)
To be fair, a turn 2 hasty Kaalia is not entirely easy, but it is possible.
dontmess17
★★☆☆☆ (2.8/5.0)(4 votes)
works very well in a reanimation deck - use Necrotic Ooze, draw 7 with it if necessary, then get out Unburial Rites and draw 14 if you li.... im just kidding ;)
Trygon_Predator
★★★☆☆ (3.1/5.0)(7 votes)
If this set already has its Powerpuff Girls, then is this Mojo Jojo? D: He likes to be called Mr. Card Advantage. Besides the obligatory Kaalia of the Vast link found on just about every angel, demon, and dragon in the game, he also goes well with Kuro, Pitlord. The lifelink offsets Kuro's ability, and the card draw is icing on the cake.
theoneandonlyjoseph
★★★☆☆ (3.0/5.0)(5 votes)
combos with venser's journal. before your upkeep, pay 7 life, gain 7 cards. upkeep- gain 7 + how many cards were already in your hand life. swing for another 7 life, spend it for 7 cards, next upkeep gain 14+life (21+ if you could afford to pay again). Laboratory Maniac incase you deck yourself out. Elixir of Immortality in case you have to discard everything, or even Tamiyo, the Moon Sage's ultimate. stock up on zombies and play rooftop storm to drop a ton of creatures all at once. now just to find a way to reliably cheat griselbrand out in in standard.
Splizer
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
Why is it that a mythic in the third set of a block related to insane crad-draw always make me have the following response: PWAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHAAAAA!!!!
It might not be Jin-Gitaxias hilarious, but ol' Gris'lbrand here IS hilarious.
sarroth
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
@Andon-A: Explain how attacking with Kaalia on Turn 2 is possible. Even if it was, it's not just something that's "not entirely easy" it's Magical Christmasland thinking.
Yes, this guy is amazing. Kaalia decks do kind of need him, since the card draw is limited mostly to Black cards already, and this is among the best available now. I don't think he will get banned in Commander, though.
MasterOfEtherium
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
ranimaTe Today Tiger LoT Trunk space Toon world iTe DAWG
Enchantment_Removal
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
@sarroth
Whenever someone says things like what Adon said, be sure to cut their deck after shuffling and keep a close eye on it at all times.
Nothing makes a card hot like the words "Draw seven".
pedrodyl
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
Isn't this like a control finisher of choice? I mean look at it: 1. It's big 2. It's got evasion. 3. It's got more control built-in with lifegain. This means if necessary, you can make the game last longer. 4. It's got more control built in with the words "Draw seven cards" This means more board control and counterspells, etc. 5. 3 fuels 4.
Sure there's an inimidating in the right hand corner, but there are plenty of duel lands available if you want to go control. It's also Legendary, but you're probably not running 4 of them anyway.
5/5
axiobeta
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
Really epic and well designed. Need one for ma solar flare. It's a shame he's dead but oh well, I heart Lili anyway
cvvc
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
I played this in the Pre-release and it is a killer shame about the mana though, but that's what druids' repository is for.
steinburger1109
★☆☆☆☆ (1.5/5.0)(7 votes)
This is dumb. Dumb dumb dumb.
Why? Because it costs as much as Avacyn, but inferior in basically every way. Both fly, but vigilance is way more powerful than lifelink. The draw effect is cool, but making everything INDESTRUCTIBLE is cooler.
JonTheRed
★★★☆☆ (4.0/5.0)(11 votes)
Necropotence is back, and better than ever. OK, no it's not, but this guy is still pretty rad.
d-101
★★★★☆ (4.2/5.0)(13 votes)
Paying life to draw cards has already proven to be broken (see Necropotence). With that card, you get them at the end of your turn. This one is an on demand draw engine, with lifelink and flying and a good body. And with all of the shenanigans black has to avoid paying for creatures, you probably won't need to hard cast it. 5/5
WarioMan
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
"Swing with Griselbrand" "okay" "blocking?" "no" "kay, pay 7 life before damage" "uhhhhh.... k" "gain life back... hey, look, it had Sword of War and Peace"
Seven power, seven toughness, seven life, seven cards...eight casting cost. You have no idea how much this annoys me. I hate whoever did that with a passion that burns like a thousand suns. One day in the paper you will read a story about how a local man was eaten alive by his own OCD, clutching a griselbrand in his cold, dead hand. That local man will be me.
Gripes aside (twitch) i opened one in the prerelease and I (obviously) won all four games that this resolved. Even without the draw ability, the 14 point life swing a turn is a game-sealer. Definite shades of baneslayer angel.
Totema
★★☆☆☆ (2.7/5.0)(3 votes)
Why can't I like this guy? The Spike in me loves him, and he really does tip the game solidly in your favor... but I am used to demons having unusual player interactions, such as Bloodgift Demon. Point being that flavor-wise, demons should not let you choose for them to use their power; they should use it whether you like it or not, and it should be up to you if that ends up working to your advantage.
Silence9
★★★☆☆ (3.1/5.0)(8 votes)
Peeled him out of a pack at the pre-release just as I wanted! Such a sick Demon!!! >=}
5/5! Big lifelinker with evasion and a sick-nasty ability that you can blow the second he comes in!! Draw Seven is phuking fun! Just smile like a doughnut for each card you draw, regardless of what it is, for the added intimidation factor of course!
YawgmothsWish
★★★★☆ (4.3/5.0)(25 votes)
Incredible card. Timmy sees a 7/7 with flying & lifelink. Johnny sees a nice toy for Liliana & Unburial Rites. Spike sees a Yawgmoth's Bargain with lifelink that doubles as a finisher.
A huge body with evasion and incredible card advantage that pays for itself, that can easily be reanimated with Unburial Rites? Sign me up. Pulled one at the prerelease, so I may be playing Frites or Necrotic Ooze combo soon.
CammyWhite
★★★☆☆ (3.9/5.0)(8 votes)
Someone, somewhere, will use his ability and draw only 7 swamps.
GreenDjinn
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.5/5.0)(3 votes)
Probably my fav card in this set, i love this dude. Fun in limited and awesome in casual formats. gain 7, lose 7, draw 7. perfecto.
KokoshoForPresident
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.5/5.0)(2 votes)
Does it really bother anyone else that Griselbrand doesn't have a title? I keep trying to remember it, but then I remember he doesn't have one. I think such an incredible card and important character deserves an awesome title. Let's make one for him! How about: Griselbrand, Lord of Darkness Any other ideas?
Razbot
★★☆☆☆ (2.8/5.0)(2 votes)
He's just so beastly. Necrotic Ooze's new best friend
blindthrall
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.5/5.0)(1 vote)
GB here broke MOE's brain.
Tearthesky
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
I know I already posted, but I wanted to add that It seems that Wizards is recognizing their endorsement of EDH/Commander. The legends, in this block especially, are pretty solid regardless of their timmy nature.
Guest1344086042
★★★☆☆ (3.5/5.0)(3 votes)
Just imagine this card played with Dream Halls in Commander...
bay_falconer
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.7/5.0)(3 votes)
A balanced Yawgmoth's Bargain. Granted, it's practically unplayable at 8 mana, but it's balanced.
bfellow
★★★☆☆ (3.0/5.0)(3 votes)
I have built a Griselbrand EDH deck. I had several turn 3 wins but it averages around turn 5-6 to win multiplayer/single player games. Easily 5/5 for reintroing a pseudo-Yawgmoth's Bargain to new players.
dlgn
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.5/5.0)(1 vote)
Jin-Gitaxias is better, but I like how this guy lets you draws even more if you want (at a hefty price, though). He also costs less, and is in the Innistrad block. Brutal with Tibalt, the Fiend-Blooded's -4.
Keiya
★★★☆☆ (3.1/5.0)(7 votes)
Whoa. Griselbrand actually makes a card like Venser's Journal seem appealing. You pay 7 life to draw 7 cards, then you gain that life back plus whatever other cards you had in your hand and you don't have to discard any of them at the end of your turn? You can essentially be gaining massive card advantage and a lot more life if you play your cards right.
Enemy_Tricolor
★★★★☆ (4.1/5.0)(5 votes)
I feel compelled to represent the Vorthos viewpoint here, and point out that it's equal parts lame and hilarious that a giant, powerful demon with ominous flavor text like Griselbrand ran into a Liliana-powered bug zapper immediately after leaving the Helvault.
Does anyone else notic this guy looks exactly like Archdemon of Greed?
battlegrizz
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
Best demon to come out. True to the color pie as black can be. He can be Brutal in any format, the art is great, he gets his own sleeves and playmat. 5 out of 5
Even if he gets Go for the Throat'd or Tragic Slip'd instantly, you can still get your +7 (or more) card advantage out of him.
Axelle
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
As part of the Innistrad card-making contest, I submitted a card named "Griselbrand, He Who Does Not Need Titles".
Guess he doesn't need a title.
vantha
★★★☆☆ (3.5/5.0)(3 votes)
Griselbrand is an awesome card, but he made one mistake, he made a deal with Liliana.
Gargantula
★★☆☆☆ (2.8/5.0)(2 votes)
As awesome as Innistrad was overall, I have to say that I really dislike Griselbrand for the way that he ruins EDH games. He should probably be banned from the format. Card draw is really powerful- its part the tripod of brokenness. Massive, repeatable card draw for one player that doesn't cost any mana? That's probably not a good idea, like, ever. And if you look a that with the fact that EDH games last longer and a player has 40 life, and you have a really pain in the ass broken card. With Griselbrand as Commander: Throw a bunch of black fast mana cards and mana rocks in your deck, put a skirge familiar, venser's journal, exsanguinate, etc. Congratulations, you've just ruined an EDH game. I wish that R & D would think about casual formats (read EDH) when they design emblematic legendary creatures, particularly if they're high CMC. Example of a wonderful emblematic legendary creature in EDH: Avacyn, Angel of Hope! She's expensive, she's huge, and her ability is awesome. Yeah, she's a win condition, and that's as it should be. But I don't find her infuriating the way that I find Griselbrand. I agree with Totema that you shouldn't have a choice about what demons do- they should just do it, and you should have to deal with the consequences. And basically, I think that Yawgmouth's Bargain is bad for the game. Not printing Yawgmouth's Bargain, ever, should be a hard and fast rule, IMO.
Finally, Griselbrand has CMC 8. What's up with that, R & D? Asymmetrical clunkiness makes Maro cry.
auriscope
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
Desperately needs to be banned in EDH. Bargain is banned because you frequently win as soon as it comes into play, and you can't reanimate Bargain.
Dream_Twist
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
Has anyone else seen this card show up in some of the newer Reanimator decks in Legacy? Seriously, I wonder why this is becoming a target now.
I think for one thing you could hard cast it. It also negates that reanimate you played. Lifelink is pretty good, but it's ability is not typically what a Reanimator deck wants to do (all Jin-Gitaxas aside).
This guy is blackest thing out there in Standard right now, so I respect it, as he is super bad and epitomizes what I would consider Suicide-Black.
MightySqueeth
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
A must have in any Hypergenesis deck
adrian.malacoda
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
I like to imagine this guy riding into battle atop a pelakka wurm for no apparent reason.
This guy is noteworthy because they killed him off literally seconds after they previewed him. Yawgmoth, this guy ain't.
And in a case of life imitating art, banned in EDH a month after he was released. Can't ol Grizzy get a break here?
MyrBattlecube
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
Now banned in EDH. I'm sure Wizards will get around to updating here in the near future.
RJDroid
★★★★☆ (4.1/5.0)(14 votes)
Griselbrand got himself grisel-banned.
What fun we had in EDH while it lasted. I shall always remember drawing half my library and winning on the spot. Good night, sweet prince, and may a pack of devils sing thee to thy rest.
OmegaReborn
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
Even though I play Drana EDH, I knew to not invest in this. This card was already too good to be true. We all know why Yawgmoth's Bargain is banned over Necropotence, and it certainly follows true here, as well as gives us an unnecessary (but cool) 7/7 flying lifelink trample demon guy.
Yawgmoth's Bargain doesn't gain you life, kill creatures or deal damage (with evasion, mind you). And you expect that we should get this for EIGHT MANA? If this was printed on a 13 mana Eldrazi, it would still be iffy, and maybe banworthy. At 8, you have so much silliness that'll get you up the like Cabal Coffers, Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth, Extraplanar Lens, Gauntlet of Power, Caged Sun, Heartless Summoning and so forth (the intricate stuff like Dark Ritual or Ashnod's Altar don't really always count), you'll be getting this guy out turn 3-6. Or you could Entomb/Exhume it on turn one with a Dark Ritual, however Reanimator tactics generally start turn 2-3 in EDH, so you can feasibly get him out on turn three just in time to drop a nice Reliquary Tower, so you can have a 25 card hand and constantly have an answer to every single thing the opponent does, as well as most of your combo pieces.
So if you thought Kokusho was bad, this guy was just... Unfair.
Enelysios
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
Guy lasted longer in the story than he did in EDH.
Not a very surprising ban though. I knew it was probably coming but I made him my captain since all my friends made decks around the legendary angels from the set. Yeah, once I upped my land count to 40 I never lost a game. The reliability of ramping into this on turn six or so, drawing thirty-five to fifty cards, dropping a reliquary tower, Lightning Greaves (Or equivilent) and Empyrial Plate and winning instantly was staggering. In the rare event that someone could respond to any of this, you can still get the card draw!! It doesn't matter if he is on the bottom of my library.
A couple times I had to wait and win with a massive, ramped up Exsanguinate, but that wasn't exactly unreliable. The worst part was that he wasn't fun. He would hit the field, and I would spend five minutes drawing cards, then I would play a couple things while my friends watched, then I won.
There is no beating mana-free, instant speed card draw, but at one life for one card? They know better by now!! When has this NOT been stupidly powerful? Maybe if they added a tap to the mana cost? It would still certainly be a playable card.
Sleep well young Griselbrand, we hardly knew ye...
BANNED IN EDH! He was flat out nasty in that format.
TheAmberSpyglass
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.5/5.0)(1 vote)
Have oversized version of him....run in my planar deck? LOL.
What a bad demon. This is exactly what I expect and love from black. Needs undying.
ParallaxtheRevan
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.5/5.0)(2 votes)
The irony of Griselbrand is I actually don't see you drawing very many 'real' cards with him actually.
He's a 7/7 lifelinker with evasion.
You combo him out, and start attacking people to kill them. His pay life ability offers him protection because people DON'T want you to do that in response to a kill spell to 'replace' him.
Alright, so in Commander, he's just tiny and it's a very different story: They WILL want to kill him, you WILL...get a load of other cards anyway...and they WILL....die anyway. But he's banned there now so that doesn't count, exactly.
My speculation, admitting no experience on it, is that in Legacy/Vintage, where you have less life to pay AND less life you need to take to win, is that he probably races/kills pretty fast and even tho you draw the cards anyway 'because they're free and you can', you probably don't actually get a chance to use them much. Your deck can do other things sure, if it's comboing it wants at least two different things to combo out, but really, how many times does Griselbrand actually die in games, vs. how many times he just swings like Babe Ruth and win?
And if he doesn't die, are you really going to have the time to use the cards before his damage wins for you? I'm not knocking the card draw at all- just comparing it to nuclear deterrence: it's mere presence is enough to decrease the likelihood of it's actual use, except only in Tendrils Storm. It wouldn't work if he didn't have at least the THREAT of it though.
And if he's really ONLY being used for Tendrils Storm, which is a mega-exception to to all ^^^that...then, well....people shouldn't be allowed to own Tendrils because it makes them lazy and unfun :P
Plantix
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
I used Bone Splinters sacrificing a 1/1 human token to kill this guy. The dude I faced was ***ed.
Arachibutyrophobia
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
so, I got an oversized version of Grizz from the Helvault, but I can't use him in edh? :\
Cloudeye
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
I feel sorry for him. I mean...he will never be able to use spoon and fork! Not even chopsticks! Well I don't know how you eat souls to be honest...maybe straw is enough?
Jokes aside, he was banned ind EDH for the reason. Still the teror of the kitchen table but not EDH anymore...sad. I will for forever remember his tag team with Niv Mizzet in my Sedris, the Traitor King deck.
Gris is at the same time more and less balanced then Necropotence. Card draw is faster and you get the NOW compared to potance. At the same time trought he can be dealt with easier for being creature, costs more and you HAVE to pay 7 life...a bit less controlable the Necropotance - there is a bigger risk that you get big burn to tha face. Unlike Potence however he can replenish your life pool and kill opponent at the same time. Necropotance unlike Gris can be pulled on first turn with the help of Dark Ritual and be ready for you we you need cards. It's also and enchantment - pernament type which was hardest to get rid off until we got planeswalkers. And many decks don't run enchantments removal. Verdict? Run which suits you playstyle more...or both.
rollinsclone
★★☆☆☆ (2.8/5.0)(2 votes)
Correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe he is the strongest lifelinker in the game. Oh, and he's Necropotence with wings. That's pretty good too.
Gcrudaplaneswalker
★★☆☆☆ (2.8/5.0)(2 votes)
One of the best Reanimator targets in the game. Life loss? Who cares, you'll gain it back :)
NoIHavent
★★★☆☆ (3.3/5.0)(3 votes)
"Here at Yawgmoth's Emporium, we're dedicated to bringing you the best deals for card drawing in the multiverse. If you liked our incredible " Yawgmoth's Bargain " deal, you'll love our new Griselbrand bundle, you keep your same low, low, low, life to card cost, with addition of an efficient beater, for only 2 extra mana, and a 7 card contract! If the contract seems a bit much, don't fret, the Griselbrand Bundle will replenish your life in no time, all you have to do is untap with it! Call and order yours today! "
Edit:
And now why not cheat him out t5 with Rakdos, lord of riots and some good land drops? Sounds like a plan to me.
TheWrathofShane
★★☆☆☆ (2.8/5.0)(3 votes)
Necropotence's model should never be attempted. 1 life for 1 card has always proven to be broken. Yawgmoth's Bargain was another example. This card is obviously weaker then both of those, but that still does not excuse it. Greed should be the model used whenever they want this effect. 7 cards for 14 life would still be incredible.
.5/5 for foolish developers. With any luck, we will never see this broken model again.
jontagion
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.5/5.0)(1 vote)
Stop printing busted not-red cards and print more busted red cards, please.
Hua9801
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
Think of it this way... it is BETTER than "Whenever this creature deals damage, draw 7 cards", and that is already absurdly good.
Todris052
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
I love it how his name is just Griselbrand. Not Griselbrand, Demon of Despair, to mirror Avacyn - just Griselbrand.
I think, for what it gives you, it was somewhat well designed.
The 1 card for 1 life model, as TheWrathofShane said, is broken. However, this forces you to draw in multiples of 7, similar to Jin-Gitaxias. Sometimes, you'll only want 2 or 3 cards, but you can't. Sometimes, you'll be at 6 life, and you can't. That's a problem.
The should be something people shouldn't look past. It, like Phyrexian Obliterator, forces you to go Mono-Black, which limits your card choices. Obviously, this a secondary reason why he's almost only used for reanimation.
Truthfully, the best way to make him "Fair" is to make it " - Draw 7 cards and lose 7 life". The ability to do it multiple times and at instant speed is exactly what ruins him. It's a good thing he's banned in EDH. I know that facing him as a commander is NOT pretty.
Demonic_Professor
★★★☆☆ (3.0/5.0)(1 vote)
Compare this directly to Yawgmoth's Bargain and you'll realize that it isn't that much less broken.
It costs {B}{B} more, but nobody gives a shit because they can just cheat it out anyways. It can only draw in batches of 7, which, yes, is a significant downside, but it can heal you back, which is a significant upside. It can die easier because its a creature, but also it can deal damage because its a creature. Oh, and it has flying, so its especially good at that whole deal damage thing.
It feels to me in a format with Reanimator and Entomb etc... this thing is just as deadly as the bargain.
For the record, I think that although this thing is much more broken, its about 1000000000000000000000000000000000000000 times more fun to play than bargain, both with and against.
Arachnos
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
I think his effect shares a spot with Jin-Gitaxias for highest preset card draw effect. (Other cards may draw you more cards if specific conditions are fulfilled, but no other card specifically says to "draw seven cards" or more.)
doktor_doom
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.5/5.0)(1 vote)
love love love this guy. i can't ask for a better black fatty. as black as it gets. i'm stubborn enough to play him in my standard mono black control deck. stellar flavor, great abilities, reasonable cmc for what's on offer, sick art as is the norm with kieryluk. even if grissy gets hosed or o-ringed next turn he still gives you value with card draw assuming you have enough life. i don't award 5 ratings easily but this guy is it. i would have sex with him if i could. he's that good.
Halaphax
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.8/5.0)(2 votes)
Type your comment here.
azure_drake222222
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.8/5.0)(2 votes)
8 pages of comments, top comment 4 stars. No 5-star comments?
Smoke_Stack
★★★☆☆ (3.2/5.0)(3 votes)
This guy's gonna see so much more play in mono black now that there's crypt ghast. Turn 5 Griselbrand anyone?
DarthParallax
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.5/5.0)(3 votes)
Gris-el-brand. Vol-de-mort. Demon-That-Needs-No-Title/He-Who-Must-Not-Be-Named Make 7 Horcruxes: Write 7 books. Lich. Lifelink? Seriously? Ookaaay... The difference between this guy and Mojo Jojo: Mojo Jojo doesn't know AVADA KEDAVRA. Give this guy Undying and Persist. You know you want to.
Edit: So, I am thinking this guy should be called out as EXACTLY a 6/5 stars, no more, no less. He's very, very abusable, but he's not actually bannable in Legacy or restrictable in Vintage. He's banned in Commander but that format's nature was different enough from 60-card Constructed to let him run completely unleashed and amok.
Let's imagine a scale where ''9/5'' is the Power Nine "8/5" is "All that Urza Block bull-shit" and "7/5" are "abusable cards that are very tough to answer either on speed or on rules" Animate Dead, for example, or a Balance cast by a person that knows what they're doing, tend to be 7/5 cards because in addition to having an utterly blowout effect, there's a very short list of plans you have time to use to do something about it, most of them involving "Counter it.", yet they still don't really warrant mass concessions because sometimes you've GOT something. (Certain Urza Block bull-*** combined with the Power Nine and any of a number of favored win-cons do not normally give you the chance to have a turn.)
6/5 cards tend to be how the decks that use 7/5 cards finally win: 6/5 cards are the Dumbest Creatures Imaginable, but all creatures have a plethora of Achilles' Heels that, in addition to be countered, can be hit with all kinds of other things too. Even Progenitus is a 6/5. Maybe 6.5/5. The 7/5's are the cards that plant Stupid Creatures down Stupid Fast and often in an uncounterable way, closing the biggest weakness of cards that once they become permanents are hard to target effectively. Griselbrand is a creature, and he's not even the best creature of all time, he's just simply a very easy creature to build profitable combos with because so many of the cards you'd use are either in his own colors or an ally color. (Red in particularly being a great friend of adding extra abuse to the combat step.)
And if you MUST ask what "10/5" is, it's the Dredge Deck. No single card in it even ranks above a 5.5 out of 5 (Super powerful but fair out of context when you aren't bending it over backwards), but the Dredge Deck's whole is way, way more than the sum of its parts. It's got a guaranteed Game 1 Win. GUARANTEED. Something like 97+%. It is ultimately better than the Power Nine, but the Power Nine can do a hundred different tricks, while Dredge is just one single 'Perfect Trick' that needs its whole deck to work.
Lifegainwithbite
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.5/5.0)(1 vote)
People that think this basically sums up to 'Whenever this creature deals damage, draw 7 cards' are forgetting a good few advantages of this way: 1) It can be used as soon as Griselbrand is put out even though it doesn't have haste. 2) If you have life to spare, it can be used multiple times. 3) Even if your opponent can stop you dealing damage, they can't stop you drawing the cards. This card is unbelievably overpowered and with reanimator decks, you can get it out really quickly.
I came up with a fixed and cheaper version of him: Griselbrand, Lord of Shadows 4BBB Flying, lifelink 7/7 At the beginning of your upkeep, lose 7 life and draw 7 cards. Sacrifice a creature: Gain 1 life and draw a card. Whenever a creature attacks you, it's controller gains 1 life and draws a card.
It's cheaper and it's a lot less unfair but it's still really powerful. It also has the same potential for infinite combos that the original has.
@recurringmemories: And that, is why people don't play legacy. If anyone's wondering what he's talking about: Swamp, dark ritual, entomb Griselbrand, exhume.
AncientTimer
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
Once again Black gets the best creature of the set. Demon worship continues at WotC.
And where exactly is the demonic part excluding the creature type text? Just a bunch of great stats & abilities with extremely low mana cost. No negatives at all? That's not demonic.
And since when did lifelink become a demonic ability? Suits for vampires but not for demons.
snickerpuss
★★★★☆ (4.7/5.0)(15 votes)
combos with library
RecurringMemories
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
He may not be the "best" creature in Magic, but flavour wise he is definitely my favourite. Still working on a re-animate deck to put him in.
@Cloudye; Griselbrand can easily (well on a good draw) hit the table turn one....and then you're opponent hits him with a Swords to Plowshares. Sad Panda.
@Smoke_Stack: Still doesn't beat a Turn 1 Griselbrand! ;)
@Lifegainwithbite: Legacy? Who said Legacy? That's my play in Casual, lol (well sometimes it's Jin-Gitaxias, Core Augur). Generally Legacy players don't run Ritual; they keep the space for Force of Will and Daze.
Salient
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
Thematically perfect for Legacy Reanimator. Entomb, Exhume, exploit for your gain: You're basically following the plot arc in which Griselbrand gets Helvaulted, freed by Liliana, and used like the Veil-beholden tool that he is.
DBlack
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.5/5.0)(1 vote)
Hey i call ***, how the hell did that guy stab Avacyn with his spear... he has no hands... unless by spear they mean... ewwwww
How long is an angels Gestation period? Because there certainly was alot of angels in AVR
Pun-Pun
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
This card was in the very first booster pack I ever opened. And, being an inexperienced new player, traded it for Kalitas, Bloodchief of Ghet. *** you, past me.
Liliana: Not even Garruk is as dense as you. Thanks for nothing.
Mikaeus: Brains.
strider24seven
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
Pro Turn 1 at a local Vintage Tournament (on the play): -Bazaar of Baghdad, Lion's Eye Diamond -Tap Bazaar, Draw 2, Discard Golgari Grave-Troll, Bridge from Below, Dread Return -Cycle Street Wraith, Dredge Grave Troll, milling Bridge from Below, 2x Narcomoeba, Stinkweed Imp, Cabal Therapy, Griselbrand -Narcs hit play, sac 1 to cast Therapy, naming Force of Will (therapy whiffs), putting 2 zombies into play from Bridge -Sac narc and 2 zombies for dread return targeting griselbrand, put 2 zombies into play from bridge -pitch hand to lion's eye diamond -Activate griselbrand, dredge (over 7 individual draws) for a total of 34 cards, hitting the remaining 2 narcomoebas and a 3rd bridge. -Sac 2 narcs and a zombie, dread return laboratory maniac, put 6 zombies to play from bridge -Activate griselbrand to dredge a grave troll and draw the remaining cards for the win.
And for all those saying G-Brisel dies to removal: He still draws you 7 or 14 cards (sometimes more, but rarely). Turn 1 dies to StP? No problem, I'll just get 7 cards for free. Turn 1 dies to Path? No problem, I'll just pay 7 life for 7 cards and a swamp Also he doesn't die to Doom Blade.
He's pretty borked- banned in EDH for good reason. He usually wins the game whenever he hits play, same as Necropotence.
Tamerlein
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
This is the most powerful demon in the current standard format. If you do play either with or against him remember that despite there being three 7s in his text, his casting cost is actually eight.
I traded for one of these guys the day before he was banned in commander, so I'd never gotten a chance to play with him. After months of him sitting in my binder, I decided to test him out in a deck I was making. And hot damn. What a BAMF It's pretty nice always having a full hand, especially whilst beating the hell out of your opponent. 5/5
Continue
★★★★★ (5.0/5.0)(5 votes)
And you don't have to skip your draw step. What the hell...
Now there's a sentence that has never caused problems in Magic's past.
Claytoon
★★★★☆ (4.6/5.0)(7 votes)
Dev1: But we want to bring back Necropotence's card drawing engine. But what kind of body should we put it on so it won't be broken? Dev2: How about putting it on a 7/7 lifelinking flyer? Dev1: Brilliant!
Xineombine
★★★★★ (5.0/5.0)(5 votes)
Look kids, A win condition!!!
Bulhakas
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
Being legendary keeps it from being broken hurr durr.
sweetgab
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
Even Wizards talked about how people complain about this card not costing seven despite having 7s everywhere else. But I fail to see how this could have been solved in a better way.
- Do they make him even more powerful by simply cutting a mana? - Do they change him to an 8/8 and his ability to Pay 8 life: draw eight cards, ruining the connection to the numerous "draw seven"s in Magic's past and make a ridiculous Lorthos impression? - Do they deliberately break the pattern by say, making him a eight mana 6/9 that draws seven cards for 7 life?
It seems to me that the printed version is the most elegant by far.
LeoKula
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
this is still no match to the skull
Pipikako
★★★★★ (5.0/5.0)(4 votes)
Pay 7 life: You win the game.
DrJack
★★★★☆ (4.7/5.0)(10 votes)
And this raging powerhouse of a creature's drawback is WHAT...???
See kids, this is why large, powerful creatures need significant drawbacks. When you "cheat" cards like this into play with Eureka, Show and Tell, Quicksilver Amulet, 3 lucky Dark Rituals, etc. there has to be a tradeoff, a risk, for doing so. Here, there is no risk. It's pure profit for nothing.
Look at older big boys like Lord of the Pit, Force of Nature, and the (slightly overcosted) Elder Dragon Legends. Their drawbacks were to make sure that they weren't too easy to cheat onto the battlefield. They were designed that way for a reason.
Wizards, it's time to turn back the clock and do what you did right the first time.
DoorDie
★★★★★ (5.0/5.0)(4 votes)
It's the lifelink that's the real kick-in-the-balls. By the time he gets hardcast via chained rituals or gets reanimated, your life total would allow for 7 or 14 cards drawn. The former isn't totally backbreaking for your opponent, but the latter should be so long as you don't die.
But these days Demons are so sweet they'll give you that life right back so you'll always win the game. How thoughtful.
"The world, he thinks, will behold Griselbrand in all his majesty once more, and on their knees they will weep."
One of the best creatures in the game, bar none.
Fightohydra
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.5/5.0)(1 vote)
Some of you may know him by his EDH name, Grisel-BANNED.
SirLibraryEater
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
Let's see, lifelink damage, gain 7 life... I didn't need that 21 life anyway, right? Once at an FNM I saw a guy playing a Fist of Suns deck with Emrakul, the Aeons Torn, Avacyn, Angel of Hope, and this jerk. The guy he played against had a lockdown control deck, featuring Helvault, among other things. They won the event from sheer flavor points for exiling Avacyn and Griselbrand to the Helvault.
car2n
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
Too bad drawing a tone of cards is a loser strategy in Magic ;p
helluin
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
Griselbroken
Kadaver666
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
I'm both happy and sad to have Griselbrand banned in edh. Happy that he's not on the opposite of the board from me. Sad that he's not on my side lol
Android21A
★★☆☆☆ (2.8/5.0)(2 votes)
Griselbrand got Griselbanned in Commander
Pongdok
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
Yet another badass that I took out of my reanimator deck. Demons have lost their way. People weren't using them because of the drawbacks, I guess, but now they're strategically too similar to angels (most of whom I despise). (Sidenote: Linvala, Iona and Avacyn are the worst offenders and shouldn't be played against friends you intend to keep.) Griselbrand would still have been good if he didn't have lifelink and only drew you three or four cards. I don't know what was going on in development in this set. I guess it was the old "sell more boosters" directive.
The drawback for Griselbrand is that you feel a little dirty using him. There is virtually no in-game drawback, which is too bad. Swing for seven, gain seven life, pay seven life, draw seven cards, repeat as necessary until victory occurs. Pretty gross.
Demons should have comparatively low mana costs, but high strategic costs (card/board disadvantage, or life loss) that will lose you the game if you aren't careful.
I'm giving Griselbrand 5/5 for being a trooper. Avacyn's a tough rival. We shared a dream, he and I. Gut that filthy skank, pull out her writhing bowels and stuff them down her stupid throat.
Beisman01
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
Spirit of the Labyrinth.
OlvynChuru
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
Cast this guy, and in a few turns at most, your opponent will meet a grisely fate.
Comments (109)
Also, a bunch of 7s on a Demon.....odd.
To be fair, a turn 2 hasty Kaalia is not entirely easy, but it is possible.
and draw 14 if you li.... im just kidding ;)
He likes to be called Mr. Card Advantage. Besides the obligatory Kaalia of the Vast link found on just about every angel, demon, and dragon in the game, he also goes well with Kuro, Pitlord. The lifelink offsets Kuro's ability, and the card draw is icing on the cake.
now just to find a way to reliably cheat griselbrand out in in standard.
It might not be Jin-Gitaxias hilarious, but ol' Gris'lbrand here IS hilarious.
Yes, this guy is amazing. Kaalia decks do kind of need him, since the card draw is limited mostly to Black cards already, and this is among the best available now. I don't think he will get banned in Commander, though.
Whenever someone says things like what Adon said, be sure to cut their deck after shuffling and keep a close eye on it at all times.
Nothing makes a card hot like the words "Draw seven".
I mean look at it:
1. It's big
2. It's got evasion.
3. It's got more control built-in with lifegain. This means if necessary, you can make the game last longer.
4. It's got more control built in with the words "Draw seven cards" This means more board control and counterspells, etc.
5. 3 fuels 4.
Sure there's an inimidating
5/5
It's a shame he's dead but oh well, I heart Lili anyway
Why? Because it costs as much as Avacyn, but inferior in basically every way. Both fly, but vigilance is way more powerful than lifelink. The draw effect is cool, but making everything INDESTRUCTIBLE is cooler.
"okay"
"blocking?"
"no"
"kay, pay 7 life before damage"
"uhhhhh.... k"
"gain life back... hey, look, it had Sword of War and Peace"
Gripes aside (twitch) i opened one in the prerelease and I (obviously) won all four games that this resolved. Even without the draw ability, the 14 point life swing a turn is a game-sealer. Definite shades of baneslayer angel.
5/5! Big lifelinker with evasion and a sick-nasty ability that you can blow the second he comes in!! Draw Seven is phuking fun! Just smile like a doughnut for each card you draw, regardless of what it is, for the added intimidation factor of course!
So many synergies, so little time.
Block: Unburial Rites
Standard: Unburial Rites
Extended: Fauna Shaman with Necrotic Ooze
Modern: Goryo's Vengeance
Legacy: Dread Return, Exhume, Animate Dead, Show and Tell
Vintage: Oath of Druids, Necromancy, Dance of the Dead
Let's make one for him!
How about: Griselbrand, Lord of Darkness
Any other ideas?
It's on Infernal Plunge!
Even if he gets Go for the Throat'd or Tragic Slip'd instantly, you can still get your +7 (or more) card advantage out of him.
Guess he doesn't need a title.
With Griselbrand as Commander: Throw a bunch of black fast mana cards and mana rocks in your deck, put a skirge familiar, venser's journal, exsanguinate, etc. Congratulations, you've just ruined an EDH game.
I wish that R & D would think about casual formats (read EDH) when they design emblematic legendary creatures, particularly if they're high CMC. Example of a wonderful emblematic legendary creature in EDH: Avacyn, Angel of Hope! She's expensive, she's huge, and her ability is awesome. Yeah, she's a win condition, and that's as it should be. But I don't find her infuriating the way that I find Griselbrand.
I agree with Totema that you shouldn't have a choice about what demons do- they should just do it, and you should have to deal with the consequences. And basically, I think that Yawgmouth's Bargain is bad for the game. Not printing Yawgmouth's Bargain, ever, should be a hard and fast rule, IMO.
Finally, Griselbrand has CMC 8. What's up with that, R & D? Asymmetrical clunkiness makes Maro cry.
I think for one thing you could hard cast it. It also negates that reanimate you played. Lifelink is pretty good, but it's ability is not typically what a Reanimator deck wants to do (all Jin-Gitaxas aside).
This guy is blackest thing out there in Standard right now, so I respect it, as he is super bad and epitomizes what I would consider Suicide-Black.
This guy is noteworthy because they killed him off literally seconds after they previewed him. Yawgmoth, this guy ain't.
And in a case of life imitating art, banned in EDH a month after he was released. Can't ol Grizzy get a break here?
What fun we had in EDH while it lasted. I shall always remember drawing half my library and winning on the spot.
Good night, sweet prince, and may a pack of devils sing thee to thy rest.
Yawgmoth's Bargain doesn't gain you life, kill creatures or deal damage (with evasion, mind you). And you expect that we should get this for EIGHT MANA? If this was printed on a 13 mana Eldrazi, it would still be iffy, and maybe banworthy. At 8, you have so much silliness that'll get you up the like Cabal Coffers, Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth, Extraplanar Lens, Gauntlet of Power, Caged Sun, Heartless Summoning and so forth (the intricate stuff like Dark Ritual or Ashnod's Altar don't really always count), you'll be getting this guy out turn 3-6. Or you could Entomb/Exhume it on turn one with a Dark Ritual, however Reanimator tactics generally start turn 2-3 in EDH, so you can feasibly get him out on turn three just in time to drop a nice Reliquary Tower, so you can have a 25 card hand and constantly have an answer to every single thing the opponent does, as well as most of your combo pieces.
So if you thought Kokusho was bad, this guy was just... Unfair.
Not a very surprising ban though. I knew it was probably coming but I made him my captain since all my friends made decks around the legendary angels from the set. Yeah, once I upped my land count to 40 I never lost a game. The reliability of ramping into this on turn six or so, drawing thirty-five to fifty cards, dropping a reliquary tower, Lightning Greaves (Or equivilent) and Empyrial Plate and winning instantly was staggering. In the rare event that someone could respond to any of this, you can still get the card draw!! It doesn't matter if he is on the bottom of my library.
A couple times I had to wait and win with a massive, ramped up Exsanguinate, but that wasn't exactly unreliable. The worst part was that he wasn't fun. He would hit the field, and I would spend five minutes drawing cards, then I would play a couple things while my friends watched, then I won.
There is no beating mana-free, instant speed card draw, but at one life for one card? They know better by now!! When has this NOT been stupidly powerful? Maybe if they added a tap to the mana cost? It would still certainly be a playable card.
Sleep well young Griselbrand, we hardly knew ye...
BANNED IN EDH! He was flat out nasty in that format.
What a bad demon. This is exactly what I expect and love from black. Needs undying.
He's a 7/7 lifelinker with evasion.
You combo him out, and start attacking people to kill them. His pay life ability offers him protection because people DON'T want you to do that in response to a kill spell to 'replace' him.
Alright, so in Commander, he's just tiny and it's a very different story: They WILL want to kill him, you WILL...get a load of other cards anyway...and they WILL....die anyway. But he's banned there now so that doesn't count, exactly.
My speculation, admitting no experience on it, is that in Legacy/Vintage, where you have less life to pay AND less life you need to take to win, is that he probably races/kills pretty fast and even tho you draw the cards anyway 'because they're free and you can', you probably don't actually get a chance to use them much. Your deck can do other things sure, if it's comboing it wants at least two different things to combo out, but really, how many times does Griselbrand actually die in games, vs. how many times he just swings like Babe Ruth and win?
And if he doesn't die, are you really going to have the time to use the cards before his damage wins for you?
I'm not knocking the card draw at all- just comparing it to nuclear deterrence: it's mere presence is enough to decrease the likelihood of it's actual use, except only in Tendrils Storm.
It wouldn't work if he didn't have at least the THREAT of it though.
And if he's really ONLY being used for Tendrils Storm, which is a mega-exception to to all ^^^that...then, well....people shouldn't be allowed to own Tendrils because it makes them lazy and unfun :P
Well I don't know how you eat souls to be honest...maybe straw is enough?
Jokes aside, he was banned ind EDH for the reason. Still the teror of the kitchen table but not EDH anymore...sad. I will for forever remember his tag team with Niv Mizzet in my Sedris, the Traitor King deck.
Gris is at the same time more and less balanced then Necropotence. Card draw is faster and you get the NOW compared to potance. At the same time trought he can be dealt with easier for being creature, costs more and you HAVE to pay 7 life...a bit less controlable the Necropotance - there is a bigger risk that you get big burn to tha face. Unlike Potence however he can replenish your life pool and kill opponent at the same time. Necropotance unlike Gris can be pulled on first turn with the help of Dark Ritual and be ready for you we you need cards. It's also and enchantment - pernament type which was hardest to get rid off until we got planeswalkers. And many decks don't run enchantments removal.
Verdict? Run which suits you playstyle more...or both.
Edit:
And now why not cheat him out t5 with Rakdos, lord of riots and some good land drops? Sounds like a plan to me.
.5/5 for foolish developers. With any luck, we will never see this broken model again.
The 1 card for 1 life model, as TheWrathofShane said, is broken. However, this forces you to draw in multiples of 7, similar to Jin-Gitaxias. Sometimes, you'll only want 2 or 3 cards, but you can't. Sometimes, you'll be at 6 life, and you can't. That's a problem.
The
Truthfully, the best way to make him "Fair" is to make it "
It costs {B}{B} more, but nobody gives a shit because they can just cheat it out anyways.
It can only draw in batches of 7, which, yes, is a significant downside, but it can heal you back, which is a significant upside.
It can die easier because its a creature, but also it can deal damage because its a creature. Oh, and it has flying, so its especially good at that whole deal damage thing.
It feels to me in a format with Reanimator and Entomb etc... this thing is just as deadly as the bargain.
For the record, I think that although this thing is much more broken, its about 1000000000000000000000000000000000000000 times more fun to play than bargain, both with and against.
Make 7 Horcruxes: Write 7 books.
Lich.
Lifelink? Seriously? Ookaaay...
The difference between this guy and Mojo Jojo: Mojo Jojo doesn't know AVADA KEDAVRA.
Give this guy Undying and Persist. You know you want to.
Edit: So, I am thinking this guy should be called out as EXACTLY a 6/5 stars, no more, no less. He's very, very abusable, but he's not actually bannable in Legacy or restrictable in Vintage. He's banned in Commander but that format's nature was different enough from 60-card Constructed to let him run completely unleashed and amok.
Let's imagine a scale where
''9/5'' is the Power Nine
"8/5" is "All that Urza Block bull-shit" and
"7/5" are "abusable cards that are very tough to answer either on speed or on rules"
Animate Dead, for example, or a Balance cast by a person that knows what they're doing, tend to be 7/5 cards because in addition to having an utterly blowout effect, there's a very short list of plans you have time to use to do something about it, most of them involving "Counter it.", yet they still don't really warrant mass concessions because sometimes you've GOT something. (Certain Urza Block bull-*** combined with the Power Nine and any of a number of favored win-cons do not normally give you the chance to have a turn.)
6/5 cards tend to be how the decks that use 7/5 cards finally win: 6/5 cards are the Dumbest Creatures Imaginable, but all creatures have a plethora of Achilles' Heels that, in addition to be countered, can be hit with all kinds of other things too. Even Progenitus is a 6/5. Maybe 6.5/5. The 7/5's are the cards that plant Stupid Creatures down Stupid Fast and often in an uncounterable way, closing the biggest weakness of cards that once they become permanents are hard to target effectively. Griselbrand is a creature, and he's not even the best creature of all time, he's just simply a very easy creature to build profitable combos with because so many of the cards you'd use are either in his own colors or an ally color. (Red in particularly being a great friend of adding extra abuse to the combat step.)
And if you MUST ask what "10/5" is, it's the Dredge Deck. No single card in it even ranks above a 5.5 out of 5 (Super powerful but fair out of context when you aren't bending it over backwards), but the Dredge Deck's whole is way, way more than the sum of its parts. It's got a guaranteed Game 1 Win. GUARANTEED. Something like 97+%. It is ultimately better than the Power Nine, but the Power Nine can do a hundred different tricks, while Dredge is just one single 'Perfect Trick' that needs its whole deck to work.
This card is unbelievably overpowered and with reanimator decks, you can get it out really quickly.
I came up with a fixed and cheaper version of him:
Griselbrand, Lord of Shadows 4BBB Flying, lifelink 7/7
At the beginning of your upkeep, lose 7 life and draw 7 cards. Sacrifice a creature: Gain 1 life and draw a card. Whenever a creature attacks you, it's controller gains 1 life and draws a card.
It's cheaper and it's a lot less unfair but it's still really powerful. It also has the same potential for infinite combos that the original has.
@recurringmemories: And that, is why people don't play legacy. If anyone's wondering what he's talking about:
Swamp, dark ritual, entomb Griselbrand, exhume.
And where exactly is the demonic part excluding the creature type text? Just a bunch of great stats & abilities with extremely low mana cost. No negatives at all? That's not demonic.
And since when did lifelink become a demonic ability? Suits for vampires but not for demons.
@Cloudye; Griselbrand can easily (well on a good draw) hit the table turn one....and then you're opponent hits him with a Swords to Plowshares. Sad Panda.
@Smoke_Stack: Still doesn't beat a Turn 1 Griselbrand! ;)
@Lifegainwithbite: Legacy? Who said Legacy? That's my play in Casual, lol (well sometimes it's Jin-Gitaxias, Core Augur). Generally Legacy players don't run Ritual; they keep the space for Force of Will and Daze.
How long is an angels Gestation period? Because there certainly was alot of angels in AVR
Mikaeus, The Unhallowed: Brains?
Liliana: Mik, seriously!
Mikaeus: BRAINS!
Liliana: Dammit, Mik!
Mikaeus: Guuuuaahhhchhhhh....
Liliana: Screw this. When I'm done with that demon, I'm going to cut out Geralf's heart with his own letter opener.
Mikaeus: Geralf brains?
Liliana: *Sighs* sure. You can eat his brain. Now where's Griselbrand?
Mikaeus: Helvault.
Liliana: Great. How do I get him out?
Mikaeus: ....
Liliana: Not even Garruk is as dense as you. Thanks for nothing.
Mikaeus: Brains.
-Bazaar of Baghdad, Lion's Eye Diamond
-Tap Bazaar, Draw 2, Discard Golgari Grave-Troll, Bridge from Below, Dread Return
-Cycle Street Wraith, Dredge Grave Troll, milling Bridge from Below, 2x Narcomoeba, Stinkweed Imp, Cabal Therapy, Griselbrand
-Narcs hit play, sac 1 to cast Therapy, naming Force of Will (therapy whiffs), putting 2 zombies into play from Bridge
-Sac narc and 2 zombies for dread return targeting griselbrand, put 2 zombies into play from bridge
-pitch hand to lion's eye diamond
-Activate griselbrand, dredge (over 7 individual draws) for a total of 34 cards, hitting the remaining 2 narcomoebas and a 3rd bridge.
-Sac 2 narcs and a zombie, dread return laboratory maniac, put 6 zombies to play from bridge
-Activate griselbrand to dredge a grave troll and draw the remaining cards for the win.
And for all those saying G-Brisel dies to removal:
He still draws you 7 or 14 cards (sometimes more, but rarely).
Turn 1 dies to StP? No problem, I'll just get 7 cards for free.
Turn 1 dies to Path? No problem, I'll just pay 7 life for 7 cards and a swamp
Also he doesn't die to Doom Blade.
He's pretty borked- banned in EDH for good reason.
He usually wins the game whenever he hits play, same as Necropotence.
I want to make a Shadowborn Apostle deck with a few of this guy, Sign in Blood, and Immortal Servitude.
5/5 for the power and the flavor.
After months of him sitting in my binder, I decided to test him out in a deck I was making. And hot damn.
What a BAMF
It's pretty nice always having a full hand, especially whilst beating the hell out of your opponent.
5/5
Now there's a sentence that has never caused problems in Magic's past.
Dev2: How about putting it on a 7/7 lifelinking flyer?
Dev1: Brilliant!
- Do they make him even more powerful by simply cutting a mana?
- Do they change him to an 8/8 and his ability to Pay 8 life: draw eight cards, ruining the connection to the numerous "draw seven"s in Magic's past and make a ridiculous Lorthos impression?
- Do they deliberately break the pattern by say, making him a eight mana 6/9 that draws seven cards for 7 life?
It seems to me that the printed version is the most elegant by far.
See kids, this is why large, powerful creatures need significant drawbacks. When you "cheat" cards like this into play with Eureka, Show and Tell, Quicksilver Amulet, 3 lucky Dark Rituals, etc. there has to be a tradeoff, a risk, for doing so. Here, there is no risk. It's pure profit for nothing.
Look at older big boys like Lord of the Pit, Force of Nature, and the (slightly overcosted) Elder Dragon Legends. Their drawbacks were to make sure that they weren't too easy to cheat onto the battlefield. They were designed that way for a reason.
Wizards, it's time to turn back the clock and do what you did right the first time.
But these days Demons are so sweet they'll give you that life right back so you'll always win the game. How thoughtful.
"The world, he thinks, will behold Griselbrand in all his majesty once more, and on their knees they will weep."
One of the best creatures in the game, bar none.
Once at an FNM I saw a guy playing a Fist of Suns deck with Emrakul, the Aeons Torn, Avacyn, Angel of Hope, and this jerk.
The guy he played against had a lockdown control deck, featuring Helvault, among other things.
They won the event from sheer flavor points for exiling Avacyn and Griselbrand to the Helvault.
The drawback for Griselbrand is that you feel a little dirty using him. There is virtually no in-game drawback, which is too bad. Swing for seven, gain seven life, pay seven life, draw seven cards, repeat as necessary until victory occurs. Pretty gross.
Demons should have comparatively low mana costs, but high strategic costs (card/board disadvantage, or life loss) that will lose you the game if you aren't careful.
I'm giving Griselbrand 5/5 for being a trooper. Avacyn's a tough rival. We shared a dream, he and I. Gut that filthy skank, pull out her writhing bowels and stuff them down her stupid throat.