I am loving this. I would more uses for this than bloodghast. Great blocker and a 4/3 haste for 4 mana? It's epic, alongside with getting him back.
SleetFox
★★★☆☆ (3.3/5.0)(3 votes)
This works with cascade. In a perfect situation, a Bloodbraid Elf can grant you 19 points of haste power, plus an additional 3 next turn from Sprouting Thrinax (or 5 from Woolly Thoctar, though Jund decks are more likely to use it than Naya.)
That's not going to happen often, but this is still a very aggressive card.
AngelxLegna
★★★★☆ (4.6/5.0)(8 votes)
He is scary by himself. He is an absolute terror when multiple are in your graveyard. Buried Alive combo maybe.
spacechaser0001
★★☆☆☆ (2.2/5.0)(3 votes)
EPIC!!!!
HairlessThoctar
★★☆☆☆ (2.8/5.0)(8 votes)
I lol'd epically when Aaron Forsythe said he wanted this to be printed at UNCOMMON
DonRoyale
★★☆☆☆ (2.2/5.0)(3 votes)
The word "overrated" comes to mind. Recurring it requires overextension or a lucky Cascade (which is a mechanic that requires zero skill to use anyway), so either you're dumb or you're just lucky. *shrug*
lorendorky
★★★☆☆ (3.5/5.0)(1 vote)
While he seems like you have to build around him a bit too much in Standard he could be quite good in a deck with Sarkhan vol, birds of paradise, llanowar elves and hey, why not?! dragonmaster outcast what could be especially flavorful is popping Sarkhan to make all the dragons, then casting sarkhan the mad the same turn....... I think I just thought up my next deck :P
LTJZamboni
★★☆☆☆ (2.8/5.0)(2 votes)
For those of you who think this is only good in Jund with a lucky cascade, don't forget that Naya can fetch 2 creatures with Ranger of Eos that can be easily played on the same turn.
EDIT: Pulled 1 at the prerelease. Would keep bad hands with Vengevine in it just because the card is my favorite. Ended up in 7th place because of this and Linvala, Keeper of Silence
ClockworkSwordfish
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
I got this guy at the prerelease and it quickly became one of my favorites. It's got haste, but the greater-than-1 toughness to back it up and it's a good value at . Love the art as well. Still, I do NOT feel that this should be mythic rare. One by itself is solid uncommon fodder, the fact that you can run four should probably bump it up to rare, but mythic rare? I hope that the reason for this rarity is that Wizards found something in playtesting that we haven't yet that just breaks this guy. This seems unlikely, though, given Wizards record of determining what is broken (Skullclamp). Still, I like my Vengevine a lot. If it only had the Kudzu's flavour text (in my opinion the greatest plant-based flavour text of all time), it'd be my favorite creature of all time (besides Phytohydra, of course). This is just an inexplicable personal sentiment towards it, but I love this thing. It's like a security blanket; it's comforting that even when it gets Bolted, it's there, waiting. Lastly, come on; why is this not a Plant?
LoneRonin7211
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
I don't get why people are hating on this card. All you need is 1 card to bring it back EVERY TURN. Just keep playing Kor Skyfisher, bounce it to your hand, replay it, bounce it to your hand. Same CMC as Vengevine, and you can do this every turn, being kor skyfisher is always bounced to your hand. Do you have any idea how sick that is when they are in top-deck mode? If they ever draw a removal spell when you have this going, its GG, because it blanks almost every time on Vengevine. Or even better, when they blightning you? "Oh no! i have to discard my Vengevine(s)!" G/W Aggro just got incredibly real with this, ranger of eos, and kor skyfisher. Best part is kor skyfisher has barely any drawback when you don't have vengevine. "Oh no! I have to bounce a land and refuel my steppe lynx!"
Exart
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
A pretty neat trick with this one is that you cast it, it gets countered/terminated/bolted, goes to the graveyard, then you play a birds or a heirarch or whatever and it comes right back. Obvious synergy with Bloodbraid Elf, Ranger of Eos and Momentous Fall. Opponent's EOT sack Vengevine, draw 4, get 3 life, your turn play the dudes you drew and get vengevine back. Also he's awesome to discard to an early Blightning. Kor Skyfisher can bounce himself so you can play him the second time on the same turn to get Vengevine back but I don't see that happening outside of casual. I'm worried about the amount of exile removal in standard though. Once Alara rotates out life will be a lot easier for this guy.
bdlee420
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
Play Vengevine, attack, take something out and die, play another creature at 2nd main phase and he is back out.
Pretty sweet.
mordecai17
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
love the art
WhiteyMcFly
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.5/5.0)(8 votes)
Ok let's be reasonable.
First of all, cascade does not work because you do not cast the second creature. it just enters the battlefield.
Secondly, let's take a look at the stats. 4/3 Haste for 4. None too shabby. there are better green creatures out there for less mana (Leatherback Baloth, for instance), but still it's playable. It also has it's HIGHLY situational ability, which can only activate if you CAST two creatures. good luck with having those cheap creatures in your hand.
Overall, an undercosted card in my opinion, but definitely not worth its Mythic Rare status. It really should have been rare. and $90 for a play set? really? I mean, the much more versatile Training Grounds is $4 a playset (pssst! buy them now before its too late!) So yeah. money better spent elsewhere.
Robert_G
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.5/5.0)(1 vote)
Overrated, and at 25 bucks....there are dozens of cards I'd spend my money on before this.
Bloodghast is 10 times better.
Tarmin
★★★★☆ (4.0/5.0)(13 votes)
Cascade works with this, cause you get to cast a card you reveal. And even without the resurrection, this card is fantastic - I think the best from Rise.
And Bloodghast? Vengevine is 100 times better, fools.
lukemol
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
Even without Cascade, if you're playing with small creatures you can have this out by turn 3, if not sooner. Throw it in any Elf deck and you're good to go.
rsyd
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
Need to see him in action before rating but it seems pretty good.
@WhiteyMcFly, yes cascade works. "If you cast the last exiled card, you're casting it as a spell."
Killtech
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.5/5.0)(4 votes)
Umm, Awakening Zone anyone? summoning tokens counts as casting a creature, and then you only need to cast one more. and when this hits extended i can see it going will with genesis chamber or, better yet, skeletal vampire.
ericoribeiro
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
Awakening zone's tokens dont count as a spell.
Works nice with cascade and kor skyfisher Just bought a set and cant wait to build a deck around this.
blindthrall
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.5/5.0)(4 votes)
If you look at cascade's actual printing, it says play, which wouldn't trigger this. I know this because there are many times I wanted to counter a cascaded Thoctar. But Gatherer now says cast. So the question is, did wizards errata cascade to justify this thing's price tag?
Grimn777
★★★★☆ (4.6/5.0)(8 votes)
blindthrall, you are incorrect. Cascade allows you to play/cast (card/oracle) a spell without paying its mana cost, which would trigger vengevine if it was a creature from bloodbraid. If cascade meant "put into play" it would have said that, and would not have mentioned the paying of mana costs, and would be a horribly worded ability. As it is, it is very straightforward, you cast the card you cascade into.
spectermonger
★★☆☆☆ (2.8/5.0)(2 votes)
This is a great card, but $25? Where have I seen this before...Seems like it has Abyssal-Lotus syndrome...this will arc up to about $30, and then come plummeting down to $10-15
scutemob
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
very good. definitely looks mythic. surprised to see green with haste.
Lunarblade
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
Love it. Absolutely perfect for red/green aggro decks.
RafiqTheMiststalker
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
Well, yay for Aaron Forsythe. I can't understand why you wouldn't want a good card to not be mythic. It's a bit ridiculous how much this game is defined by the size of your wallet. Recently, we've faced the blight of such things like The Mind Sculptor, Lotus Cobra, Baneslayer, and now this and Gideon enjoy taking a dump on your heads, too. I wish it were an uncommon :(
thornraven
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
Better than Bloodbraid? That's certainly arguable. Better than Ranger of Eos? Not in Boss Naya. Will this card replace the best four drops? Well I certainly hope so, it's just a cool card. Will I run green just for this creature? Maybe in constructed. Could be a 5/5. Probably overrated. 4/5
Amazing art. Swanland!
NeoSin
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
Naya Zoo is an exampe of a deck that could run this well.
raptorman333
★★☆☆☆ (2.0/5.0)(3 votes)
how is this mythic rare when Boggart Ram-Gang is only an uncommon????
statiefreez
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
How is this card the best in the set? It's size is good for its cost (not to hard to play in Jund or Naya decks), but it isn't worth $35 or whatever the price is now. He might be the Lotus Cobra of this set: lots of initial hype but very useful in exactly 1 mediocre deck. I probably wouldn't play him in my mono-green deck anyway. With Garruk and Elvish Piper at 4-drops, he doesn't really have room to fit. And I'd much rather be dropping a Terra Stomper or Rampaging Baloths the next turn, either as a surprise blocker, or as a setup for Garruk's Overrun. I might sideboard him against White Weenie, but he'd just get pte'd.
What decks would everyone use this guy in?
Better than Bloodbraid? No. This guy is a 4/3 haste unless you want to lose tempo and store up creatures in your hand once he dies, or run him with Cascade creatures, or use Ranger of Eos. Jund's strength is in its ability to build up card advantage, and Vengevine cannot consistently do that.
@Nikeyeia: yes, this is better, but not by the difference between uncommon and mythic. No good 4-drops in green? Elvish Piper, Nissa Revane, and Garruk Wildspeaker in mono-green, and Cliffrunner Behemoth, Sarkhan Vol, and Bloodbraid Elf for multicolored (Naya/Jund).
Silk_Blitz
★★☆☆☆ (2.0/5.0)(3 votes)
This would def work in allies except for the not being an ally part
OpenSeasonNoobs
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
Fits perfectly in zoo. Drop him on turn 4 when you get the mana, swing with him, and say he gets his shit rocked by a kill spell. Drop your Ranger of Eos the next turn to grab your Wild Nacatl and Goblin Bushwhacker, If you managed to get 5 mana, kick the bushwacker, pull out this shiny badass from your graveyard, swing for 10 damage. Seems like a pretty amazing combo to me, just saying.
thebadbishop
★★★☆☆ (3.8/5.0)(6 votes)
Kor Skyfisher anyone?
cast him then bounce him back to your hand, then cast him again(and bounce again).
Chosen_of_the_Dark_Sun
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
Disagree that he's definitely better than Bloodghast. Yes, if you get him out he's way more powerful, but remember that the conditions for recurring Bloodghast are also a lot easier. Plus, Bloodghast+Nocturnus is absolutely terrifying.
dgregory
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.5/5.0)(1 vote)
Haste? HASTE? Where in green's color pie is there anything with haste? Apart from planer chaos color-shifting wirednes, haste should be in red and black, not green. I have no problem with the vine's regrowth ability but giving it haste is just wrong. Like, Giant Soilfugue wrong.
demonixx
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
So there's no confusion, one of the changes in m10 was to use the word "cast" instead of "play". Any pre-m10 card that says "play" means the exact same thing as "cast".
sancrosact
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
This card may not fit perfectly into the holy template of jund...so what. This is a cool atypical green card. Jund represents one of the MTGs major shortcomings..a bunch of players going out and purchasing broodmate dragons, blightnings, and bloodbraid elves online to fit a tried and true, established template. Really lame, and imagination-less in my opinion, not to mention counterproductive in terms of what mtg strives for...varied gameplay. This card would be awesome in an elf-deck, or could even be the main piece of a deck archetype in and of itself.
pixieCrack
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
Wow a retailer near me is selling this card for $45, is it really that good?
persecutor
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
I wonder what deck this'll be in once "Lights" is out.
Donovan_Fabian
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.5/5.0)(2 votes)
I don't think anyone really understands how difficult this card is to actually use, in the sense that its usually only a 4/3 haster and nothing else. It's ability is conditional, and the cards you want to play to use it are a) of the same mana level and thus make you have to fill your deck with 4 drops, and b) in a set with tons of walls, still has exiling in standard (and lots of it in ext.), and c) comes in after you have probably played most of your creatures out of your hand in an aggro deck. You have to cast the creatures also rather than have them enter the battefield. Not including graveyard manipulation (bojuka bog/jund charm) and other such recent graveyard removal cards. The reality is you will not get ranger of eos with goblin bushwacker everytime, and even if you could, you need an odd splattering of mana to make it happen.
Vengevine is also completely done in by permafrost trap, causing the vengevine to not untap for 3 turns since its an instant, for 1 blue mana. Other counters include lodestone golem (makes vengevine cost more and all 1 drops turn into 2 mana drops), and the 2 mana ethersworn canoist (disables anyone from playing more than one non artifact spell a turn so they can't cast that second creature), kazandu blademaster in allies (as soon as it gets one more counter its a 3/3 with vigilance & first strike that can block any hasting vengevine), cunning sparkmage + basilisk collar, and wall of denial (a 0/8 with shroud that can block vengevine all day long). So, it's still a very good card, seeing as green has very little in the way of hasting creatures besides cliffrunner. It's important to realize however, that its return from graveyard ability will rarely see the light of the day, and just plain wont be useful against some decks (especially white or black splash).
Nephtys
★★★☆☆ (3.2/5.0)(5 votes)
why are you mythic?
channelblaze
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.5/5.0)(1 vote)
Yeah, cascade works.And just a note OpenSeasonNoobs, it would technically take 6 mana to kick a bushwhacker and cast a ranger =). And it would be swinging for 11, not 10 (5 for vengevine, 4 for ranger, 2 for bushwhacker=11)
I saw a match at FNM, it was a jund mirror. Turns 1&2 were just playing tapped lands for both players, then the guy plays a sprouting thrinax other guys turn 3 blightning him, the guy discards...a pair of vengevines. His turn (he's on the play, in case you hadn't noticed) he cast a bbe, into hell's thunder (I didn't know people run that?) and swings for 19 (4 from BBE, 4 from hell's thunder, 8 from vengevines, 3 from sprouting thrinax). The other guy draws for his turn, pulses the vengevines....and lightning bolts himself (seppuku!). I assume he was conceding.
It was a really awesome game though.
GreyGoose
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
I love this against black decks Me: Forest Lanawar elves Opponent: Swamp Dark Ritual Ravenous Rats Mortician Beetle Me: Discard Vengevine Play Forest Play Lanawar Elves Play Birds of Paradise HOLY CRAP I have a a 4:3 creature on the field on my SECOND TURN with five green mana ready for turn two. Which I used to play my Khali Hydra. Green Rules
Nytestryke24
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
Before I start, I have to add that Vengevine is my favourite card, so this may be a little biased. I will try, however, to make it as un-biased as possible.
To all those saying the recursion is difficult, it really isn't. I've played a LOT with Vengevine, trust me. To name just a few things- Bloodbraid Elf, Ranger of Eos, Kor Skyfisher or, say, a couple of manadorks. It's not even that unrealistic to go Sea Gate Oracle/ into on 4/5 mana. Also, Sphinx of Lost Truths does crazy stuff with Vengevines. SoLT, unkicked into discarding 1, 2, or even 3 (this does happen) Vengevines. Holy cow. The potential in that is crazy. Also, don't forget you have 3! cards to fulfil that condition. You don't have to run an all-creatures deck to make this guy good, you just have to use intelligent creatures. Haste is an INSANELY good ability in the current meta, especially against the ever-pesky planeswalkers. To those saying Wall of Denial and such, in a deck with Vengevine, it's not going to be your only creature, is it? (especially if you've just recurred it) Blightning from your opponent into discarding 2 Vengevines from you is often just game over. Even 1 is pretty powerful. How is he NOT more powerful than Bloodghast? 2/1 and 4/3 is very different, and unconditional haste is a LOT better than conditional haste. Like I said, his recursion condition is not very difficult to fulfil, even if it may seem it at first. Admittedly, Path to Exile is nasty, but if they're saving their Paths for your Vengevines? All the better for you, isn't it? :) Day of Judgment-ing becomes that much worse for the control player when there's a Vengevine on the field, playing Gideon becomes that much worse when there's a Vengevine in the 'yard. One last thing, to those who've seen the M11 Spoilers- Fauna Shaman. G, tap, discard Vengevine, fetch Vengevine. G, tap, discard Vengevine, fetch Vengevine. Play Vengevine + Manadork.. Profit ;)
5/5 from me.
Mill_Master
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
This is an amazing card. Combined with Basking Rootwalla, Rofellos, Survival of the Fittest and Scryb Ranger and you have one amazing combo. Survival all of you Vengevine's to get the Rootwalla and you have 16 haste damage.
Anggul
★★★☆☆ (3.9/5.0)(5 votes)
@HairlessThoctar
I LOL'd when I was first told that cards were more powerful than they should be because they're harder to get in a booster.
Gomorrah
★★★★☆ (4.9/5.0)(38 votes)
Dies to removal, suxxors haha...
...oh wait, godammit.
DGice
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
Corpse Connoisseur to get him in there then fill the deck with BloodBraid, elvish visionary and other low cost cards to get him out, and overwhelming stampede for fun. (this deck would require mana accel)
rillaan
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.5/5.0)(1 vote)
I predict seeing this on the ban list after not to long.
also I don't see how this is better than bloodghast I've played with and against decks using both and when it's a neck to neck battle, I don't see why you would pass up a turn not to play a creature card you just drew hoping that you draw another creature next turn
Shaunafaman
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
Don't even bother trying to trade locally for this card. Either people have their play set and are using them, or they had one for about 5 seconds they got it out of the pack and someone lucky was with them and got it from them. If you want this card you're more than likely going to have to order your playset online, and they're up to 40 bucks now. This card has gotten especially popular with the the amazing synergy between itself and Fauna Shaman. The shaman itself is around $12. Since it's an an amazing answer to Jace, the Mind Sculptor, I would imagine many of you are very wrong about it being an overrated card.
Nikeyeia
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
@Raptorman333: Obiviously, because this is better. Duh!
Cascade triggers it. Cascade reads "play", but with the M10 rulings, "play" has been errataed to "cast".
Also, it might be overrated. 25 bucks may be too much. Its mythic rare status is also worth a considering, but in the right deck, its damn worth it.
A good part is, that it costs 4. Green dont have wayy too many good 4CMC spells in standard, so this comes at the right time.
Beastlygreen
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
Great green card. For those of you complaining about it being "overpowered", then this is a first for a green card while I've played Magic. For the most part, green was referred to as the worst color! You can't complain about this being "too overpowered" without saying the same for Jace the Mind Sculptor and Baneslayer Angel and Path to Exile and the 'man lands' of worldwake and Bloodbraid Elf! If I started thinking hard, I could think of others. This just levels the playing field for green.
dacow
★★★☆☆ (3.5/5.0)(8 votes)
This is a great card...but it definatly aint "mythic." It feels more like a strong rare. He's strong but not as good as what people tend to thing. It really ticks me off that wizards are really abusing the mythic feel for easy money grabs like this.
ratchet1215
★★★★☆ (4.4/5.0)(13 votes)
I think that Vengevine is a pretty cool guy. eh defines formats and doesn't afraid of anything.
PolskiSuzeren
★★★★☆ (4.1/5.0)(23 votes)
Look at all the stupid people! HAHAHAHA.
"meh, build around card. Not good for standard."
Dredgevine is raping the countryside.
"Easily see it at $10"
Really now?
"green is the worst color"
...yeah. But at least they got tooth and nail.
Guys, this guy is seeing play in legacy, ffs. In legacy, you're either A. overpowered or B. exploitable. He's both, considering I've never seen anyone actually cast him in a legacy deck. play the survival route, get all four of your vengevines in the yard, then discard two basking rootwallas. SWING
Evermint
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
@blindthrall "If you look at cascade's actual printing, it says play, which wouldn't trigger this. I know this because there are many times I wanted to counter a cascaded Thoctar. But Gatherer now says cast. So the question is, did wizards errata cascade to justify this thing's price tag?"
Play is synonymous with cast. It is not an errata. Comes into play is synonymous with enters the battlefield. It is also not an errata.
They changed the terms around to make it more accessible for newer players. It's the same reason they removed words like "bury". The extra flavor wasn't worth the weird terms.
Blackworm_Bloodworm
★★★☆☆ (3.7/5.0)(5 votes)
Oh look, a timeshifted Shambling Remains... Come on guys, it's not that hard to get rid of, with graveyard hate so prominent these days. Just drop a Bojuka Bog and end it.
Troutz
★★★★☆ (4.5/5.0)(3 votes)
If I had to draw up a creature card after Worldwake came out that green desperately needed to remain a competitive color in Standard (outside of being one of Jund's three ugly heads), it would have looked something like this: Fast Mid-range card that doesn't become worthless late-game Highly resistant to removal and countermagic
Vengevine hits all of these and then some, so yeah it was sort of a godsend for green. Especially right after Jace, the Mind Sculptor got printed and it looked like Control decks were going to sweep the format for the next two years.
landboysteve
★☆☆☆☆ (1.7/5.0)(3 votes)
This may be one of the most overrated cards I've run into in all my years of playing MTG. $40 a card? There is no way this is a $40 card. It's a $10 card at best. There are so many cards in the Eldrazi much better than this "good" card that aren't selling for nearly as much.
Hard to believe that so many people have been sucked into the hype...because that's all this card is...hype.
iaiji
★★★☆☆ (3.5/5.0)(2 votes)
Hype or not, this card is sick. This is the one card that threatens to put Survival of the Fittest , a card that has been eternal-format legal since forever, into the banned list. Survival-vine decks have to date outnumbered even the now legendary turn-0-win-prone Hulk Flash in terms of top-8 appearances all over the world. Heck, I've found myself devoting roughly 4/5 of my sideboard vs Survival vine thanks to this bad boy.
Sironos
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
4/3 with haste for 4CMC is incredible, that reanimate ability is just insane, especially combined with that haste. Another obviously overpowered mythic, this is a golden age for secondary sellers, watching the prices sky rocket while laughing all the way to the bank. One of the few decks left to play in standard without becoming poor in the process is monoblack vamps, no mythics worth it in standard since that nocturnus money maker cycled out, yes sir.
DacenOctavio
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
What, Cudgel Troll gets Haste and is now an Elemental?
HPS
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.5/5.0)(2 votes)
Those people that are saying that this card is weak and not worthy of it's Mythic Rare status are ignoramuses.
This card is a beast. Tried it with my Elven Deck and it kills fast. The elven (and mono green) decks' answer to those red-deck-wins type of builds.
This card is the centerpiece of a new super fast green mono combo I'm developing, and currently I'm 20-0 with this yet-to-be-perfected deck.
This card is cheap to cast and practical to use. Will work wonders for token and 1/1 creature relying decks.
This CARD is insane and truly deserves it's Mythic Rare Status!
iSlapTrees
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
I love the look on my friend's face when he bolted this and on the next turn, I played Bloodbraid Elf and cascaded into Boggart Ram-gang.
10 damage hasty swing never felt so sweet :)
johnxdoexsays
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
hmm.. t1= swamp, dark rit, buried alive. pull out three vengevine t2= discard two basking rootwallas (woo madness), swing for profit
BloodJunkie
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
I never fully understood the hype behind this card...
Okay... maybe I do, but still... Kinda reminds me of Masked Admirers The fact of the matter is you need to cast two creature spells a turn to be able to effectively use him. Therefore his true colors will only shine in a deck that can play (at least) two creatures every turn. Thus, his best use would be in a deck that is overflowing with card advantage (in which case I would say Masked Admirers is better because he adds to your card advantage and doesn't cost you next years tuition). The thing about that is, a deck based on card advantage rarely relies on a single card to win the game. As well, let's take a look at standard at the moment. There's exiles pouring out the cracks. Not to mention (this may just be IMO, but I know alot of people that agree with me) the best removal in the game, doesn`t put it in your graveyard. So, I would say he's a good card. He definately deserves his mythic status (because mythic is not supposed to mean overpowered, but unique which he most certainly is, barring his slightly retarded half-brother Masked Admirers). But he's not worth $40. There are better cards that can prove far more effective than vengevine using the exact same methods (Beastmaster Ascension and Tidespout Tyrant for example).
He gets a 4/5 in my book.
raadface
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
first mythic i ever opened, green creatures w/ haste are bound to be good
Rhunic_32
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
an easy 5/5
never doubt him or he will beat you plain and simple
Ive been playing decks with him in it since ROE came out. has a strong match up vs almost any deck out there. enough said. this is before and after rotation and imo he is stronger now than he was in Naya Shaman which imo (i am biased haha) was the best deck out during its time.
Mike-C
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
HELP: I just got offered a trade that seems to good to be true but I need some expert (or as close to expert as I can get) advice. I get Vengevine & Tezz-A-Bolas, he gets Koth & a foil Sword of Feast & Famine. I should.. Shouldn't I?
dragonking987
★☆☆☆☆ (1.6/5.0)(4 votes)
List of card they should reprint in the next core set! Entomb,Exhume,Iona, Shield of EmeriaSwords to Plowshares Path to Exile,Yawgmoth's Will,Bazaar of Baghdad Blightsteel Colossus,Library of Alexandria,Tinker,Painter's Servant,Grindstone,Dark Ritual,Black Lotus the moxs,Time Walk,Ancestral Recall,Tendrils of Agony,Mana Drain,Force of Will,Channel,Demonic Tutor.
EpitomeOfEvilness
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
@mic-c He gets the better side by about 30 bucks. But thats only because the SOFAF is foil. Otherwize, its your deal You are giving about 100 bucks, and he is giving about 70.
Jedijoe
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
In Vintage, Legacy, and Extended, this SHOULD be used with creatures that have evoke...
Judgemaster_Rolan
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
This card wouldn't really be all that great as a black card where there are many abilities like this, but as a green card it excels. It is also one of only 8 mono-green creatures in all of Magic that out-and-out have Haste.
SniperJolly
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
Combos with creatures.
Myrofkoth
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
luv the art
ObsessedAddict
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
imo, this is a pretty ridiculous card. Totally worth the price (I mean money wise, mana costwise too xP) Just for kicks on Magic Workstation I built a RecSur deck (Recurring Nightmares + Survival of the Fittest to anyone not knowing what it is) that ran lots and lots of Vengevines. And I must say, it was quite ridiculous.
Using survival of the fittest to discard vengevines to tutor up some big fatties, or sometimes even another vengevine was just hilariously epic.
Crag-Hack
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
Valakut takes a dumb all over vengevine decks.. :( Needs something as broken as Survival of the Fittest to be a true powerhouse. Otherwise, its just good.
pigknight
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
This guy is the entire reason I run Nihil Spellbombs in my sideboard.
Superllama12
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
This guy is so cool! The art is amazing, the 4/3 hastiness is sweet, and the ability is awesome! I, personally, do not have any decks that can abuse this, so I don't completely understand the power of this guy, but from what I've heard, he is nasty (which I absolutely believe)!
TheSwarm
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
@ Hairless Thoctar
I wish this card was printed at uncommon. It makes sense, because it has a really good constructed ability that isn't be all end all in limited. Mind you, this argument doesn't work because of cawblade back in the day and valakut and twin today, but vengevine is insane, and could have been one of the best cards in the format, easily, expecially before rise of the eldrazi. When bloodbraid elf was the most powerful card in the format, standard thrived and tournaments had really good turnouts because it was an uncommon, and therefore very accesible. It makes sense that vengevine should be printed at uncommon for the same reason, and that it wont totally wreck limited formats. Honestly, a 4/3 with haste and a lousy recurrence ability (in limited) isn't THAAAT impressive in limited. In constructed, you realize that fauna shaman and birds of paradise and llanowar elves and squadron hawks and swords of feasts and of famines are in the format and it becomes, as stated, insane.
AffinityFrank
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
i was a little late on the Vengevine train to make much use out of him in standard, but ive dedicated a Modern deck to this amazing card. its G/r, featuring alot of haste creatures like Uktabi Drake , Groundbreaker , and obviously, Vengevine . it packs some land hate in the sideboard, because from what i understand, Valakut was a real problem for this deck stype in standard.
Easily in my top ten favorite green creatures ever. Maybe it's just the art, but I've cast my fair share of these bad boys in Naya decks and survival decks alike. This is one of those cards I never regret casting, even when it gets countered or bolted. And for that, I give it a 5/5.
Salient
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.5/5.0)(1 vote)
No nonlegendary mythics, please. You could've named it "Vengevine, Root of Sorrow" or something.
It had a good run with Fauna Shaman. That was a pretty decent combo.
U/W control still ruled standard when it was around though.
Azraelean
★★☆☆☆ (2.0/5.0)(3 votes)
I would run 4 of him and 4 Dryad arbor or some other 0 casting cost creatures to get him out quick.
Fireballmage
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.5/5.0)(1 vote)
While I dislike how expensive this thing is, I like that it shows how much fat they're willing to give Green. Green's creatures should be the best, no ifs and buts about it.
TheWrathofShane
★★★☆☆ (3.5/5.0)(3 votes)
Hey the ten dollar prediction guys were right, this dude is exactly ten dollars now... Then again this is the guy that pushed survival to be banned, causing his price to drop.
What??? Is there some synergy that I'm not seeing because Restoration Angel doesn't help trigger Vengevine by bouncing a creature. You must be casting another creature, not two creatures entering the battlefield
Gheridarigaaz
★★★★★ (5.0/5.0)(3 votes)
Oh look... I got a couple of Gravecrawlers in my graveyard... wow now i got a couple of vengevines on the field
:D
BongRipper420
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
So many people talk about the power leve of this card, that I feel like not enough people appreciate the epic artwork here. Props to Raymond Swanland for this masterpiece.
Andromeiylochk
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
It's my fourth turn. I tap out and cast Vengevine, then swing with that, a Young Wolf, and a Dungrove Elder for 10. Opponent's fourth turn he smiles and casts Wrath of God. My fifth turn I smile and pass the turn with an empty board. Opponent taps out for a Bloodgift Demon and passes turn, before the end of the turn I cast Ambush Viper and Wolfir Avenger, returning the destroyed Vengevine and an additional Vengevine I discarded during my opponent's 3rd turn Mind Rot. I go on to swing for 13 damage out of nowhere.
That may be a very specific and seemingly unlikely circumstance, but it's more likely than you would think. And the ability to go from an empty board to swinging in for massive damage is incredible for green.
DarthParallax
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.5/5.0)(2 votes)
He's powerful, no doubts there. He has no evasion.
He's the Green Demigod of Revenge, obviously, very epic to have lots of him in your grave, and 4 mana is quite the sweet spot, but...
I don't feel his set symbol is the right color. I don't like the color of his set symbol when I cast him. I feel like Mythics should always feel great to cast. Maybe I'm wrong. If he had Trample, I don't think he'd be very much more powerful than he is now, because the 'cast 2 creatures' ability is what drives so much of how he is played, his potential, just, everything...
Either have him be 4/5, or give him Trample, and I'd be quicker to think he's Mythic. Just Winning Games isn't enough to make a card Mythic, because almost all Tribal Lords are Rares, Lightning Bolt is common, and for sheer number there are probably more great Uncommons than any other rarity level in the game. I mean holding the cards to a Constructed Standard. Most Commons exist because they allow the Limited format to exist and they keep it healthy. In any-size, any-rules Constructed, I expect the Uncommons you'd consider calling really good to outnumber the Commons actually, because most of them are supposed to be good, and Rares tend to be narrower, and there just aren't that many Mythics compared to other Rarities.
That's it's way more than just Deck Playability to qualify as being Mythic, and Vengevine is really skirting that line hardcore.
pedrodyl
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
Hmm well now he's more like 15$. Sucks. I've always enjoyed self-reanimating guys like this, Demigod of Revenge, and Nether Spirit. They are fun to build around, always trying to fulfill some circumstance so that your creatures have this great resiliency.
avishai
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
Use this together with Faithless Looting and a couple of memnites for a 1st turn 4-8 damage. Not to mention drawing a couple of assault strobes to make it 8-16 with infernal plunge. All depends on a good draw.
Bloodghast does not specify that it is being "cast" from the graveyard; it just returns. So this combo would not work.
OstravaBoletaria
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
Is using Bloodghast's landfall classed as casting it? if so, Buried Alive, put Vengevine and 2x Bloodghast into your graveyard, then play a land and get the Bloodghasts out, then activate Vengevine's ability and bring him out too. two 2/1s and a 4/3 with haste isnt bad for three mana.
EDIT: Oh well, would have been awesome though.
blurrymadness
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
What be even weirder? Use Evoke and Madness creatures to get him out. Awesome critter with Basking Rootwalla and Tortured Existence.
Comments (103)
That's not going to happen often, but this is still a very aggressive card.
EDIT: Pulled 1 at the prerelease. Would keep bad hands with Vengevine in it just because the card is my favorite. Ended up in 7th place because of this and Linvala, Keeper of Silence
Obvious synergy with Bloodbraid Elf, Ranger of Eos and Momentous Fall. Opponent's EOT sack Vengevine, draw 4, get 3 life, your turn play the dudes you drew and get vengevine back.
Also he's awesome to discard to an early Blightning.
Kor Skyfisher can bounce himself so you can play him the second time on the same turn to get Vengevine back but I don't see that happening outside of casual.
I'm worried about the amount of exile removal in standard though. Once Alara rotates out life will be a lot easier for this guy.
Pretty sweet.
First of all, cascade does not work because you do not cast the second creature. it just enters the battlefield.
Secondly, let's take a look at the stats. 4/3 Haste for 4. None too shabby. there are better green creatures out there for less mana (Leatherback Baloth, for instance), but still it's playable. It also has it's HIGHLY situational ability, which can only activate if you CAST two creatures. good luck with having those cheap creatures in your hand.
Overall, an undercosted card in my opinion, but definitely not worth its Mythic Rare status. It really should have been rare. and $90 for a play set? really? I mean, the much more versatile Training Grounds is $4 a playset (pssst! buy them now before its too late!) So yeah. money better spent elsewhere.
Bloodghast is 10 times better.
And Bloodghast? Vengevine is 100 times better, fools.
@WhiteyMcFly, yes cascade works. "If you cast the last exiled card, you're casting it as a spell."
Works nice with cascade and kor skyfisher
Just bought a set and cant wait to build a deck around this.
I wish it were an uncommon :(
Amazing art.
Swanland!
What decks would everyone use this guy in?
Better than Bloodbraid? No. This guy is a 4/3 haste unless you want to lose tempo and store up creatures in your hand once he dies, or run him with Cascade creatures, or use Ranger of Eos. Jund's strength is in its ability to build up card advantage, and Vengevine cannot consistently do that.
@Nikeyeia: yes, this is better, but not by the difference between uncommon and mythic. No good 4-drops in green? Elvish Piper, Nissa Revane, and Garruk Wildspeaker in mono-green, and Cliffrunner Behemoth, Sarkhan Vol, and Bloodbraid Elf for multicolored (Naya/Jund).
cast him then bounce him back to your hand, then cast him again(and bounce again).
Vengevine is also completely done in by permafrost trap, causing the vengevine to not untap for 3 turns since its an instant, for 1 blue mana. Other counters include lodestone golem (makes vengevine cost more and all 1 drops turn into 2 mana drops), and the 2 mana ethersworn canoist (disables anyone from playing more than one non artifact spell a turn so they can't cast that second creature), kazandu blademaster in allies (as soon as it gets one more counter its a 3/3 with vigilance & first strike that can block any hasting vengevine), cunning sparkmage + basilisk collar, and wall of denial (a 0/8 with shroud that can block vengevine all day long). So, it's still a very good card, seeing as green has very little in the way of hasting creatures besides cliffrunner. It's important to realize however, that its return from graveyard ability will rarely see the light of the day, and just plain wont be useful against some decks (especially white or black splash).
I saw a match at FNM, it was a jund mirror.
Turns 1&2 were just playing tapped lands for both players, then the guy plays a sprouting thrinax
other guys turn 3 blightning him, the guy discards...a pair of vengevines. His turn (he's on the play, in case you hadn't noticed) he cast a bbe, into hell's thunder (I didn't know people run that?) and swings for 19 (4 from BBE, 4 from hell's thunder, 8 from vengevines, 3 from sprouting thrinax). The other guy draws for his turn, pulses the vengevines....and lightning bolts himself (seppuku!). I assume he was conceding.
It was a really awesome game though.
Me:
Forest
Lanawar elves
Opponent:
Swamp
Dark Ritual
Ravenous Rats
Mortician Beetle
Me:
Discard Vengevine
Play Forest
Play Lanawar Elves
Play Birds of Paradise
HOLY CRAP I have a a 4:3 creature on the field on my SECOND TURN with five green mana ready for turn two. Which I used to play my Khali Hydra.
Green Rules
To all those saying the recursion is difficult, it really isn't. I've played a LOT with Vengevine, trust me. To name just a few things- Bloodbraid Elf, Ranger of Eos, Kor Skyfisher or, say, a couple of manadorks. It's not even that unrealistic to go Sea Gate Oracle/ into on 4/5 mana.
Also, Sphinx of Lost Truths does crazy stuff with Vengevines. SoLT, unkicked into discarding 1, 2, or even 3 (this does happen) Vengevines. Holy cow. The potential in that is crazy. Also, don't forget you have 3! cards to fulfil that condition.
You don't have to run an all-creatures deck to make this guy good, you just have to use intelligent creatures.
Haste is an INSANELY good ability in the current meta, especially against the ever-pesky planeswalkers. To those saying Wall of Denial and such, in a deck with Vengevine, it's not going to be your only creature, is it? (especially if you've just recurred it)
Blightning from your opponent into discarding 2 Vengevines from you is often just game over. Even 1 is pretty powerful.
How is he NOT more powerful than Bloodghast? 2/1 and 4/3 is very different, and unconditional haste is a LOT better than conditional haste. Like I said, his recursion condition is not very difficult to fulfil, even if it may seem it at first.
Admittedly, Path to Exile is nasty, but if they're saving their Paths for your Vengevines? All the better for you, isn't it? :)
Day of Judgment-ing becomes that much worse for the control player when there's a Vengevine on the field, playing Gideon becomes that much worse when there's a Vengevine in the 'yard.
One last thing, to those who've seen the M11 Spoilers- Fauna Shaman. G, tap, discard Vengevine, fetch Vengevine. G, tap, discard Vengevine, fetch Vengevine. Play Vengevine + Manadork.. Profit ;)
5/5 from me.
I LOL'd when I was first told that cards were more powerful than they should be because they're harder to get in a booster.
...oh wait, godammit.
also I don't see how this is better than bloodghast I've played with and against decks using both and when it's a neck to neck battle, I don't see why you would pass up a turn not to play a creature card you just drew hoping that you draw another creature next turn
Cascade triggers it. Cascade reads "play", but with the M10 rulings, "play" has been errataed to "cast".
Also, it might be overrated. 25 bucks may be too much. Its mythic rare status is also worth a considering, but in the right deck, its damn worth it.
A good part is, that it costs 4. Green dont have wayy too many good 4CMC spells in standard, so this comes at the right time.
"meh, build around card. Not good for standard."
Dredgevine is raping the countryside.
"Easily see it at $10"
Really now?
"green is the worst color"
...yeah. But at least they got tooth and nail.
Guys, this guy is seeing play in legacy, ffs. In legacy, you're either A. overpowered or B. exploitable. He's both, considering I've never seen anyone actually cast him in a legacy deck. play the survival route, get all four of your vengevines in the yard, then discard two basking rootwallas. SWING
"If you look at cascade's actual printing, it says play, which wouldn't trigger this. I know this because there are many times I wanted to counter a cascaded Thoctar. But Gatherer now says cast. So the question is, did wizards errata cascade to justify this thing's price tag?"
Play is synonymous with cast. It is not an errata.
Comes into play is synonymous with enters the battlefield. It is also not an errata.
They changed the terms around to make it more accessible for newer players. It's the same reason they removed words like "bury". The extra flavor wasn't worth the weird terms.
Come on guys, it's not that hard to get rid of, with graveyard hate so prominent these days. Just drop a Bojuka Bog and end it.
Fast
Mid-range card that doesn't become worthless late-game
Highly resistant to removal and countermagic
Vengevine hits all of these and then some, so yeah it was sort of a godsend for green. Especially right after Jace, the Mind Sculptor got printed and it looked like Control decks were going to sweep the format for the next two years.
Hard to believe that so many people have been sucked into the hype...because that's all this card is...hype.
This card is a beast. Tried it with my Elven Deck and it kills fast. The elven (and mono green) decks' answer to those red-deck-wins type of builds.
This card is the centerpiece of a new super fast green mono combo I'm developing, and currently I'm 20-0 with this yet-to-be-perfected deck.
This card is cheap to cast and practical to use. Will work wonders for token and 1/1 creature relying decks.
This CARD is insane and truly deserves it's Mythic Rare Status!
10 damage hasty swing never felt so sweet :)
t1= swamp, dark rit, buried alive. pull out three vengevine
t2= discard two basking rootwallas (woo madness), swing for profit
Okay... maybe I do, but still... Kinda reminds me of Masked Admirers
The fact of the matter is you need to cast two creature spells a turn to be able to effectively use him. Therefore his true colors will only shine in a deck that can play (at least) two creatures every turn. Thus, his best use would be in a deck that is overflowing with card advantage (in which case I would say Masked Admirers is better because he adds to your card advantage and doesn't cost you next years tuition). The thing about that is, a deck based on card advantage rarely relies on a single card to win the game. As well, let's take a look at standard at the moment. There's exiles pouring out the cracks. Not to mention (this may just be IMO, but I know alot of people that agree with me) the best removal in the game, doesn`t put it in your graveyard. So, I would say he's a good card. He definately deserves his mythic status (because mythic is not supposed to mean overpowered, but unique which he most certainly is, barring his slightly retarded half-brother Masked Admirers). But he's not worth $40. There are better cards that can prove far more effective than vengevine using the exact same methods (Beastmaster Ascension and Tidespout Tyrant for example).
He gets a 4/5 in my book.
never doubt him or he will beat you plain and simple
Ive been playing decks with him in it since ROE came out. has a strong match up vs almost any deck out there. enough said. this is before and after rotation and imo he is stronger now than he was in Naya Shaman which imo (i am biased haha) was the best deck out during its time.
Entomb,Exhume,Iona, Shield of EmeriaSwords to Plowshares
Path to Exile,Yawgmoth's Will,Bazaar of Baghdad Blightsteel Colossus,Library of Alexandria,Tinker,Painter's Servant,Grindstone,Dark Ritual,Black Lotus the moxs,Time Walk,Ancestral Recall,Tendrils of Agony,Mana Drain,Force of Will,Channel,Demonic Tutor.
He gets the better side by about 30 bucks. But thats only because the SOFAF is foil. Otherwize, its your deal
You are giving about 100 bucks, and he is giving about 70.
Just for kicks on Magic Workstation I built a RecSur deck (Recurring Nightmares + Survival of the Fittest to anyone not knowing what it is) that ran lots and lots of Vengevines. And I must say, it was quite ridiculous.
Using survival of the fittest to discard vengevines to tutor up some big fatties, or sometimes even another vengevine was just hilariously epic.
I wish this card was printed at uncommon. It makes sense, because it has a really good constructed ability that isn't be all end all in limited. Mind you, this argument doesn't work because of cawblade back in the day and valakut and twin today, but vengevine is insane, and could have been one of the best cards in the format, easily, expecially before rise of the eldrazi. When bloodbraid elf was the most powerful card in the format, standard thrived and tournaments had really good turnouts because it was an uncommon, and therefore very accesible. It makes sense that vengevine should be printed at uncommon for the same reason, and that it wont totally wreck limited formats. Honestly, a 4/3 with haste and a lousy recurrence ability (in limited) isn't THAAAT impressive in limited. In constructed, you realize that fauna shaman and birds of paradise and llanowar elves and squadron hawks and swords of feasts and of famines are in the format and it becomes, as stated, insane.
Life and Limb + Explosive Vegetation/Harrow won't bring Vengevine back. Not only are lands not spells, but explosive Vegetation & harrow simply put them into play. Neither will Myr Servitor.
Kor Skyfisher works though
U/W control still ruled standard when it was around though.
Restoration Angel.
Restoration Angel."
What??? Is there some synergy that I'm not seeing because Restoration Angel doesn't help trigger Vengevine by bouncing a creature. You must be casting another creature, not two creatures entering the battlefield
:D
Opponent's fourth turn he smiles and casts Wrath of God.
My fifth turn I smile and pass the turn with an empty board.
Opponent taps out for a Bloodgift Demon and passes turn, before the end of the turn I cast Ambush Viper and Wolfir Avenger, returning the destroyed Vengevine and an additional Vengevine I discarded during my opponent's 3rd turn Mind Rot. I go on to swing for 13 damage out of nowhere.
That may be a very specific and seemingly unlikely circumstance, but it's more likely than you would think. And the ability to go from an empty board to swinging in for massive damage is incredible for green.
He's the Green Demigod of Revenge, obviously, very epic to have lots of him in your grave, and 4 mana is quite the sweet spot, but...
I don't feel his set symbol is the right color. I don't like the color of his set symbol when I cast him. I feel like Mythics should always feel great to cast. Maybe I'm wrong. If he had Trample, I don't think he'd be very much more powerful than he is now, because the 'cast 2 creatures' ability is what drives so much of how he is played, his potential, just, everything...
Either have him be 4/5, or give him Trample, and I'd be quicker to think he's Mythic. Just Winning Games isn't enough to make a card Mythic, because almost all Tribal Lords are Rares, Lightning Bolt is common, and for sheer number there are probably more great Uncommons than any other rarity level in the game. I mean holding the cards to a Constructed Standard. Most Commons exist because they allow the Limited format to exist and they keep it healthy. In any-size, any-rules Constructed, I expect the Uncommons you'd consider calling really good to outnumber the Commons actually, because most of them are supposed to be good, and Rares tend to be narrower, and there just aren't that many Mythics compared to other Rarities.
That's it's way more than just Deck Playability to qualify as being Mythic, and Vengevine is really skirting that line hardcore.
I've always enjoyed self-reanimating guys like this, Demigod of Revenge, and Nether Spirit. They are fun to build around, always trying to fulfill some circumstance so that your creatures have this great resiliency.
Not to mention drawing a couple of assault strobes to make it 8-16 with infernal plunge.
All depends on a good draw.
Bloodghast does not specify that it is being "cast" from the graveyard; it just returns. So this combo would not work.
EDIT: Oh well, would have been awesome though.