Eats other mass removal like supreme verdict and Terminus for breakfast. Powerful on its own
flavioal28
★☆☆☆☆ (1.6/5.0)(4 votes)
Worse than Gideon Jura in my opinion. "Hah! I use his +1 to give him 6 loyalty counters!, next turn he's an 11 indestructible creature! Bet you're pretty scared, huh?" *Opponent swings with his 6 creatures, kills Gideon, or even worse, kills you It's a shame, given the original Gideon was so good...
Arachibutyrophobia
★★☆☆☆ (2.8/5.0)(4 votes)
flavor wise, this seems like the most badass planeswalker. like gideon from Near-Death Experience.
ButlerOfBolas
★★★★☆ (4.6/5.0)(23 votes)
"Hello, ladies. I'm Gideon. Whoa, steady there. I'm just on Ravnica for the weekend. Heard some Dimir butts needed kicking. Of course, Boros calls on the most badass and" *flips his luxuriouly long locks* "SEXIEST planeswalker around. But don't get too excited. I'm already in a relationship with Worldslayer. We've got a lot in common, you see. But I suppose I can leave you with this." *throws breastplate into screaming mob of girls*
SyntheticDreamer
★★☆☆☆ (2.7/5.0)(9 votes)
Extremely lackluster compared to the original Gideon Jura. Sure, his art's good, but he can't protect himself (he can't animate himself to block), and even if you get his ultimate off, you'll be swinging with a 1/1 or 2/2 afterward, giving your opponent a chance to regroup.
+1: Ahh, I have been waiting for a real challenge! 0: Fight me! -15: FOR GREAT JUSTICE
Jake1991
★☆☆☆☆ (1.7/5.0)(5 votes)
Gideon is a Super Saiyan.
+1: Increase power level. 0: Starts fighting. -15: Spirit Bomb.
Villainous1
★★★★☆ (4.2/5.0)(9 votes)
-15: It's fine dude, I'll deal with this myself!
Temeshi
★☆☆☆☆ (1.7/5.0)(3 votes)
only problem i have with this card is...unless you get his -15 off w/o killing him, in what world would you want to get rid of not just your opponents perms, but yours as well? Unless you're trying to do the Thragtusk/Worldfire combo thing...but even then its not a wincon...just too difficult to use effectively in current standard.
Excaelezar
★★☆☆☆ (2.7/5.0)(9 votes)
Older Gideon's so much better. This one doesn't affect the board at all, Vraska's better for board presence than he is. He just sits there gaining counters. His first ability is just plain bad, sure if your opponent has a lot of creatures he gets big but then you're dead anyways so it doesn't matter. His 0 is ok now he has indestructible added on but still, a set 6/6 compared to a variable is better. His ults no good, you need 20+ counters to make it worthwhile so you win. And as far as board presence goes he still sucks, when you play a walker you want to DO something with them, he doesn't so even if you have a board presence you're much better off playing other cards instead.
MockingJ
★★★☆☆ (3.4/5.0)(7 votes)
if you use his +, he will get a ton of loyalty, but your opponent's creatures can just turn around and kill him. He can't protect himself like Jura could.
Purplerooster
★★☆☆☆ (2.8/5.0)(2 votes)
HIs plus 1 isn't usually good, because if it is getting a lot of counters, your opponent has a bunch of creatures. It would be nice to use after an Army of the Damned and then play a board wipe.
Ronar288
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
Sideboard against tokens? That's my first thought.
Ferlord
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
The obvious problem is that he gets bigger and better when there's more threats that can kill him.
It's a complete gamble: if they have 10 creatures, SURE, you could get 10 loyalty counters, but 1: how long is he going to survive, and 2: WHAT?! YOU LET THAT HAPPEN?!
Vividice
★★☆☆☆ (2.4/5.0)(5 votes)
Most bland Planeswalker printed so far?
ThisisSakon
★★☆☆☆ (2.3/5.0)(6 votes)
My word guys. A 3.2? Planeswalkers should never be rated below 3.5! You guys are acting so spoiled! Even if there isn't a large number of creatures an opponent controls, he's still at least an indestructible 4/4 for 2WW that dodges control's best friend: Supreme Verdict.
.Blaze.
★★★★☆ (4.2/5.0)(9 votes)
People seem to be missing that after you -15 your going to have mana floating to cast something big. They also seem stuck on the worse case where your opponent has a ton of guys. No, in a normal game your opponent will have 3 or 4 guys on the field when you +1 giving him 8 or 9 loyalty and assuming you haven't been doing nothing you should be able to protect him such that on turn 5 your attacking with a guy that puts them on a 3 turn clock. Yes, old Gideon was better, but being worse than one of the best walkers isn't a bad thing.
deserter
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
He DOES exile all permanents with his ultimate ability including lands. How some think opponent could recover with 0 lands on board at something like turn 7-8 is beyond me. About +1 and +0: Yes he can't defend himself on opponents turn but he is a bomb that has to be dealt with immediately. Minimum 4/4 indestructible triggering batallion and accepting any other bonuses of creatures for the turn. What more do you want?!
Statement: You can tap all your mana and have that much floating mana in your pool, then drop the -15 and exile everything and then spend the mana that YOU STILL HAVE IN YOUR MANA POOL. (likely 7 or 8 depending on the current turn / ramp and what not) Your opponent on the other hand just lost everything, literally.
Congrats, you essentially set the game back to turn 1 except you have a planeswalker and 7 - 8 mana to spend on turn 1. Now that is what I call an insanely defining advantage.
Question: Why so much hate?
pedrodyl
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
This Gideon is essentially more of a creature than a planeswalker. He can be a very well-costed creature most of the time, since he can just sit and tack on counters the first turn you play him. But well, his +1 doesn't really do anything to the board state besides threaten his ultimate, and his ultimate wipes the board and leaves him, but only as a really weak creature most of the time.
SRSFACE
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
As has been stated, floating mana helps a ton here.
Also, there are all sorts of things that allow you to escape your own boardwipes. You could use Oblivion Ring, Detention Sphere, and Fiend Hunter to target some of your own creatures or permanents. If you splashed green for Thragtusk, that also works.
He actually fits blue/white or white/green Pillowfort decks quite well.
mdakw576
★★☆☆☆ (2.5/5.0)(2 votes)
Nice wall of text there, Gideon.
I view him as just a huge creature, seeing as how the +1 gives him more counters and the 0 turns him into an attacker. And the ultimate you almost never judge planeswalkers on. Thus I rate him compared to other 4 cmc creatures.
What kind of deck would want him? Any aggro boros deck would prefer hellrider. Naya would want huntmaster and/or restoration angel. Control decks don't want him because he can't do anything on defense unless your opponent willingly attacks into him. I can't imagine any sort of UW tempo would want him either.
I can't give 5 because 15 is a lot, and it's not for each opponent...but I had to read that first ability twice to make sure I was reading it right.
MrHobbles
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
Haziad, from http://media.wizards.com/images/magic/tcg/resources/rules/MagicCompRules_20121001.txt:
106.4. When an effect produces mana, that mana goes into a player's mana pool. From there, it can be used to pay costs immediately, or it can stay in the player's mana pool. Each player's mana pool empties at the end of each step and phase.
d-101
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
I really like this new planeswalker; he comes out a turn earlier than old Gideon, gets big fast, and hits hard with impunity. His ultimate is really icing on the cake, but can be life saving. He won't bust standard open, but he is a credible threat that demands an answer. 5/5
Rafiking007
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
I love Gideon. In any game, I challenge any person not to want clear the board and then use Faith's Reward to bring your stuff back. Perfect combo guys.
FaceClaimer
★★☆☆☆ (2.8/5.0)(2 votes)
Gideon with the pillow fort is hilariously effective and noone has accounted for it. toss out multiple sphere of safety, Oblivion Ring, detention sphere and safe passage and you will have a nasty planeswalker. manual protection exists people!
psychichobo
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
You know what bugs me about this card?
The previous Gideon wasn't indestructible, he just had the 'prevent all damage' clause.
I'm wondering if people just had too much trouble using him only to lose him to removal.
Agrising
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
Before saying Gideon, Champion of Justice is useless and giving him anything less than a 3.5, read this:
While I will admit, not exactly what everyone was expecting for the new Gideon, he could still see some use. As of a matter of fact, he cost 1 mana less than his counterpart, allowing him to come out and beef up with his +1 on the first turn he is out to have at least a 5/5 indestructible swinger on turn 5, which would be when old Gideon would have come out but couldn't attack using his 0 ability due to summoning sickness. Many people overlook this, as this Gideon works IMO better than the last one when it comes to their 0 ability. Sure, he doesn't have the great -2 the first Gideon had, but his +1 essentially says "Hit me before I get any bigger and blow up the field!", similar to old Gideon's taunt ability except not mandatory which was what I assume Wizard's was going for here. But enough of comparison's, Gideon 2.0 is not as splashable as 1.0, but can still find users to those who love vigilance (for being able to attack and protect Gideon), Walls (except no one really runs these) and control decks. People are also forgetting that his -15 is not mandatory. You don't have to sit and wait for his ultimate, as of a matter of fact, I rather swing with 15/15 indestructible than use his ultimate. His use goes with his 0 ability just like the last Gideon, except a turn earlier and can survive Doom Blade and Go for the Threat. So before giving him anything less than 3.5, consider his various uses rather than his seemingly one dismensionaltiy and comparisons to his former self.
(Note: By no means am I saying he is better than Gideon Jura, but he can still can contend as being a useful planewalkers just as much).
Jack-o-Crow
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
@Haziad
Observation: In my experience, if a Planeswalker card is not deemed as amazing on its debut then it receives a lukewarm reception at best.
Amused addendum: I find it fascinating as to how many of these Planeswalkers have mechanics that seem to yell "Kill me! Oh please lay your blades into my bulbous meatbag exterior!" Such pleading for self-destruction is both curious yet satisfying. Gideon in particular seems to excel in this overly immediate pleading for punishment. While I can undoubtedly agree with the pleasure in causing suffering upon others I cannot fathom why a meatbag would want to call such damage onto themselves. Most curious.
rebelrebel
★☆☆☆☆ (1.5/5.0)(1 vote)
@Rafiking007 Faith's Reward won't work with him, if it did this would be a playable card... but it doesn't... so it's not....
Yozuk
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
He is kinda... Umm.. You know what! NO! NO!... I'm not doing this. 5/5 for art alone. He looks like a BOSS!
vantha
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.5/5.0)(2 votes)
Edrazi: "We eat Planeswalkers for breakfast" Gideon: Ultimate...."You got served"
TheWildFamily
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
Been playing this guy inOrzhov and I gotta say, he is perfect at keeping your opponent from attacking you due to the large amount of counters he can get. I also love ciphering Undercity Plague onto him, which takes his creature status to a whole n'other level!
spartan7023
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
i agree that this gideon is not quite as good as jura, but i still thing he is powerful. i think control could benefit from using him with wraths. 1 or 2 more loyalty points wound not have made him broken.
yergie123
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
Always remember the best card to deal with Gideon during combat: Skullcrack
figgerhaggotnater
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
@ SyntheticDreamer
Was the original Gideon ever capable of animating himself to block?!?!?!?!?!??!?!?!?
Totema
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
If it bothers you that he dies too easily to a creature swarm, may I remind you that you're playing him with one of the best damage-preventative colors in the game? In standard format, Divine Reflection seems to be a good (if costly) way to help keep him alive, but otherwise you can use Holy Day.
PonchoGrande
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
Haha, what is this I don't even. But seriously, I'm not a huge fan. A Boros colored Gideon would have been more exciting. I mean, maybe turbo fog? I just don't even want to use him in anything. Yuck.
shockmoney
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
no colonel sanders you're wrong, gideon's right. play with this guy and eat crow haters. hes stellar.
Arachnos
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
More situational than most planeswalkers, perhaps. But I can't help but like this concept that can turn what would have been a horrific loss into an epic win. Facing off against, say, a token deck, if you can just hold the fort a couple of turns (Holy Day and Safe Passage help) he can get more than 15 counters. Then you tap all your mana, blow up the field, and cast something.
Ideally, you're left with both Gideon and something else, whereas your opponent is left with nothing. There is no coming back from this because he blows up lands, too. Avacyn won't protect you from him, either, because he exiles.
Smoke_Stack
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
I doubt you'll need the ultimate ability. Just keep alternating between pumping him up and swinging with his 0 ability. give him trample
rollinsclone
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
Seems really situational and underwhelming. He can get a lot of counters and be an indestructible beatstick sure, but the old Gideon could do that while defending you at the same time. Probably a sideboard card this time around, which is a shame because I really love his character.
EDIT: Holy crap was I wrong about this guy. I built a UW tempo/control deck with him in it and he works wonders. Aggro will usually overextend to get at him so you can wipe the board next turn, and most control decks don't have a good way to deal with him so he becomes a very short clock. I haven't lost a single game where he hit the board.
Hunter06
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
This guy looks boss in foil, and well not as powerful as his Eldrazi era form, this guy is nasty, i lost cause he ultimated... 5/5 Stars
ParishInquisitor
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
So good in EDH! I played a game recently where, after like the fifth board-wipe, two of my opponents just couldn't stabilize and died to a bunch of angel tokens from the Ghave player's Luminarch Ascension. Then I popped Gideon's ultimate, exiling everything but Gideon himself, who still had 6 loyalty counters. After that, I just bashed my remaining opponent's face in turn after turn.
Granted, that situation is not likely to come up often, but he's still a really good planeswalker, especially for multiplayer. If he isn't dealt with immediately, he will remain a constant threat from both his combat prowess and his looming ultimate.
Demento_Recraves
★★★★☆ (4.8/5.0)(6 votes)
The threat of his ultimate combined with the ability to put so many loyalty counters on him at once makes him more or less a life gain card, if only because your opponent won't be attacking you.
DarthParallax
★★☆☆☆ (2.7/5.0)(3 votes)
"Heck" is supposed to rhyme with "Duck", but then it would get censored, ;)
RETURN TO RAVNICA......
RETURN TO RAVNICA.......
RAVNICA! HECK YEAH! GIDEON's here, to save the motherhecking DAY, YEAH!
RAVNICA! HECK YEAH! THE BOROS LEGION is the ONLY WAY, YEAH!
RAKDOS your sick games are THROUGH Cause now you have to answer to, AURELIA! HECK YEAH!
Simic can lick my butt, and suck my SURAL! RAVNICA! HECK YEAH!
It’s the DREAM that we all SHARE!!!! And NOT like the COMMIE-Tree-humping-Selesnya-"Worldsoul" SHARE! (say that 5 hecking times hecking fast in rhythm)
It's the HOPE for TOMORROW!!!! That's Tomorrow RIGHT NOW not AFTER ORZHOV TAX-ES! HECK YEAH!
This version of Gideon is seriously underrated. I ran this guy in my Boros deck, and whenever I got him on the field that game was sealed in my favor. The key was using his +1 ability in a cumulative fashion similar to that of Assemble the Legion. It didn't take long to unleash him as a 10/10 indestructible human soldier that charged into battle with the rest of my Boros creatures, triggering a plethora of Battalions that my opponents could never answer. 5 out of 5, hands down.
WateryMind
★★☆☆☆ (2.8/5.0)(4 votes)
+1: GIVE ME YOUR ENERGY 0: DON'T WORRY I GOT THIS -15: TAKE THIS! MY LOVE, ANGRY AND MY FURY!
(I'm sorry for getting the last one wrong xD)
JRE47
★★☆☆☆ (2.6/5.0)(4 votes)
Sudden Disappearance, THEN trigger Gideon's ultimate, for lulz. That card finally has a good, game-ending use!
TexasDice
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
You guys know, that simply play creatures could protect him very fine, right?
n00biy
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
I like this version more than the other. It gains life a lot faster than the other version, comes out sooner, and like someone else said a lot earlier, if you can't protect this guy enough, you have more pressing issues at hand.
Playing his ultimate might work well with free creatures, definitely aggro decks (a repeatable wrath of god that is also a creature?), and if your opponents have been using stuff like oblivion ring on your guys this version can save them...
To those who say it is only good in certain situations, I have to say that that is how people win - making the situation that favors them, so this card is like any other not as obviously beneficial card (maybe for instance Doran, Siege Tower).
If my memory is correct, there was a pro tour winning deck recently which recycled a single artifact doing 2 damage at a time, endlessly.
This seems to be a relatively easy card to work around, compared with something like Form of the Dragon, in my opinion. 5/5 for some very powerful abilities.
JohnnyDepth
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
@JRE47: I don't think that would work. If you're suggesting that you use Sudden Disappearance on yourself, and then activate Gideon's ultimate after that resolves, Gideon would be exiled along with the rest of your nonland permanents until your end step. You wouldn't be able to trigger his ultimate immediately after because he wouldn't be under your control.
TheDragonPlainswalkr
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
his abillity is epic! Gain a ton of loyalty then nuke the feild. then hes a creature!
Jayquaz
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
@Demento_Recraves:
You noticed that to huh? He basically has an extra non-loyalty ability like Garruk Relentless that says, "Creatures your opponents control attack Gideon each combat if able." The really scary thing is that more often than not he can take it or at least that has been my expedience.
noobmag1
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
A lot of people asking what deck wants him.
My Azorius EDH deck does. And while using his ultimate is devastating, so is getting 40+ counters on him when he lands and Aetherize-ing someone's insane token army.
beerious
★★★★☆ (4.1/5.0)(5 votes)
everyone is whining about him being some defenseless liability. he costs friggin four mana. If your opponent has that many threats out there that you have no answers for then Gideon's survival is the least of your worries. He is totally awesome. just accept it.
emilaeger
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
Hi one question regarding his ultimate ability. People says you can mana float and therefore doesn´t need to exile cards but can my opponent tap his mana aswell and save his mana too? I dont really think he´s that bad that many suggests I have won pretty much every game he sees the board just give him some support and have some prevent damage cards and he can really grow fast!
Lifegainwithbite
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
Fantastic for a creature, underwhelming for a planeswalker. Original Gideon remains one of the best planeswalkers ever.
@emilaeger: Yes he could but mana drains out of your pool at the end of each step so unless he had an instant, he couldn't use that mana for anything while it would still be your main phase so you could play anything.
Ruggnarok
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
Would Geth's Verdict work against Gideon after he uses his +0 ability? The part where it says "He's still a planeswalker" is what's throwing everything in to hell since everything before it is describing the kind of creature he is... so is he creature enough to count as a creature I can force my friend to sacrifice or is he still strictly a planeswalker but takes on the human soldier subtype just cuz?
He is both completely Planeswalker and completely Creature at the same time, and would be vulnerable to effects that check for either type. Dreadbore still won't kill him, though Geth's Verdict would. (Assuming he's the only creature on your opponent's board.)
Enelysios
★☆☆☆☆ (1.8/5.0)(2 votes)
He certainly has a place, but he just feels like an underwhelming one-trick pony. His strategy is straightforward and pretty easy to see coming. Charge up, nuke field, swing at opponent. Yes, he could be devastating in a control deck.
I never play planeswalkers for their ultimate, it just seems risky and too often you won't get there. Gideon's +1 is just charging up. His 0 is more interesting, but we have seen this before. Most decks I would run him in I would rather have any number of big game ending bomb creatures.
What's worse, he shares a subtype with Gideon Jura, who is a pretty impressive planeswalker with similar abilities. On the bright side, 4 mana makes him relatively aggressive.
Most underwhelming planeswalker yet in my opinion.
SAUS3
★★★☆☆ (3.2/5.0)(3 votes)
+1 and defend if the enemy has lots of creatures. +0 and attack if they have no or few creatures. -15 if there is a massive stalemate.
He's not bad imo, but it's lame to remake gideon with similar, but weaker abilities. The old gideon would rock this guy. My guess is he used all his stamina on aurelia. And they weren't fighting either.
TheWaddleDeeKing
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
The problem with Gideon, and the reason why he's barely used, is due to how most decks are either aggresive or control decks. In decks that run little to no creatures, he's basically worthless, essentially being a 4/4 indestrucitable for four that will eventually be the target of a Oblivion Ring. And, if you're opponents running aggro (such as RDW or WW), then chances are you could be dead before you even have the chance to pop his final.
I love the design of Gideon but he's not right for this Standard. There's some neat tricks that can be used in casual or EDH but it's just hard to use him to his maximum potential.
Old Gideon is one of my favorite cards ever, which is why new Gideon is one of the greatest disappointments ever. I was so excited, too. It's just a weaker version of old Gideon with an ultimate that I never want to use, because its only useful when I'm losing. What a waste of perfectly good design space.
Lord_of_phyrexia
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
I had an hour long game with my brother and then he used his ultimate, I ragequitted.( Did I use that term correctly?)
BlackKanjiTatsumi
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.5/5.0)(1 vote)
"Statement: Mana persists during phases."
This isn't true. The mana pool empties after each phase change. However, I don't see what's wrong with tapping all land, activating ultimate, then playing cards all in main phase 1.
Lord_of_Gelectrodes
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
My favorite way to use him is to float a crap-load of mana to my mana pool then board wipe. It's gonna be a long time before they block that Worldspine Wurm...
platinumlegend
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
I do like using this card in a mono white commander EDH deck
Rusty172002
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
If I enchant him with Gift of Orzhova and attack, what happens at the end of the turn when he's no longer a creature?
IIDECAYII
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
You can enchant a Planeswalker while it's a creature but the enchantment will fall off and go to the graveyard when it's no longer a creature.
TowerDefender
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.5/5.0)(1 vote)
Edit 8 Oct 13 If I or an opponent clone him while he's Indestructible Creature will the clone die due to not having any loyalty counters on it? I suppose if you had the Simic creatures that make things enter with a +1/+1 counter it would survive.. but what about the fact he's only a creature until end of turn? Would he be able to activate any of his abilities? #MakeGideonBlock
manaderp
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
TowerDefender: If you somehow flash in a Clone while your opponent controls an animated Gideon, Champion of Justice, and have it copy him, you end up with a noncreature Gideon with four loyalty counters, exactly as if you'd just cast him. The sequence of events goes as follows: Clone's ability applies as part of it entering the battlefield - it's a static ability generating a replacement effect, not a triggered ability ("as", not "when"), as Clone would die to state-based actions before such a trigger could resolve - and copies all copyable characteristics of the other creature (in this case Gideon). The copyable characteristics of something are those printed on the card (if it's copying a card that is not itself copying something), those given to a token by the effect that created it (if it's a token that's not copying something - eg. "3/3 white and green Centaur named Centaur" for Call of the Conclave), or those given to it by a copy effect, including any modifications given by the copy effect (eg. "As Boros Reckoner, except with ", : Destroy target creature with the same name as this creature."" for an Evil Twin copying a Reckoner). Once Clone's replacement effect applies, it continues entering the battlefield as whatever it's copying, including any relevant replacement effects - and planeswalkers get loyalty counters on entry as a replacement effect! However, the "creatureness" of the Gideon you copied is not copyable, because it's not an inherent part of the card, so he's not a creature (and therefore survives entering). Which, sadly for your hashtag, means he won't be blocking. For the record, the same logic applies if you copy an animated Mutavault or Keyrune - you end up with a noncreature land/artifact.
Also, using Evil Twin on Gideon would be hilarious because it still has its ability to destroy things (and it's even a copyable characteristic) but the only times when Gideon is a valid target he's also indestructible. Also, I wonder - if you copy a planeswalker like this, could the copy planeswalk? "Ohey, I'm Gideon now. Cool. Brb exploring multiverse. Good luck bro!"
Cloudchaser.Kestrel
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
I find him quite good in Azorius. Detain keeps their creatures present but defenseless for Gideon to level up on. He can human up before board-wipes and swing at a defenseless opponent after. Gideon never was suited to fighting alone. Gideon Jura needed creatures to protect him while he brought on the attack - creatures to kill the little utility creatures he'd lured in - and only after that could he retaliate. Gideon is as white as Elspeth or Ajani - he needs a strong community behind him, be it a battalion or a company of skyknights.
The deck I have around him right now is straight forward Azorius human deck, based on board wipes and battlefield medic's to keep my creature count higher than theirs. It doesn't happen very often, but my favorite thing to do is planar cleansing letting all my creatures die. Next turn tap all my mana and Gideon's ultimate. Play Angel of Glory's Rise
There is no kill sweeter than overkill.
xwhitemousex
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
I am fairly new to MTG so please bear with me if this is a silly question...
When I play Gideon and my opponent has 2 creatures, I activate his +1 and I get +1 loyalty and +2 for the creatures, totaling +3 loyalty same turn he is played and making him +7 total LP.
On the second turn, if there are still just 2 opponent creatures on the battlefield, and I activate his +1 again... Do I get +3 loyalty this time too, even if it is the same 2 opponent creatures??
Quake5master
★☆☆☆☆ (1.5/5.0)(2 votes)
Useful in my vintage deck, but not the best planeswalker. He's a threat himself, and must be targeted by instant speed exile (or -1/-1's) to be dealt with, which there is a lot of. He dodges field wipes, while still leaving a threat on the field, which is extremely useful. All around good card if he stays around long enough to abuse him. Would be pretty broke if he turned hexproof as well.
3.5/5 because he's not very flexible.
SirDrak909
★★☆☆☆ (2.0/5.0)(1 vote)
xwhitemousex yes, of course.
MattLynn
★★★☆☆ (3.2/5.0)(2 votes)
EDH? "Which opponent has the most dudes this time...?"
at0micpickle
★★☆☆☆ (2.8/5.0)(2 votes)
Just pulled this guy, didn't know what to think at first, but he is actually one of the few planeswalkers that can single-handedly win you the game, just get like 30 loyalty, wipe the board, then swing with a 15/15 indestructible creature
Elan49
★★☆☆☆ (2.0/5.0)(2 votes)
Hrmm, Gideon really annoys me. He just never does anything with his life. "Ooohh scary eldrazi, I'll go find help! Ooohh, random guild fight, I'll join in! Ooohh I don't like this guild anymore!" I'd like him if he chose a goal and stuck to it, like Venser, Koth, Karn, Urza or even Tamiyo.
Ramen_King
★★☆☆☆ (2.5/5.0)(1 vote)
Had an opponent run this with Fiend Hunter's. He exiled a couple of my bigger creatures early game, but couldn't pull off the ultimate since he was low on life by that time and my exiled creatures returning would finish him off. Good thing I had weenies to chump block his 19/19 planeswalker.
JB_Xyooj
★★★★☆ (4.0/5.0)(1 vote)
Just saying... Pillow Fort deck. You got Blind Obedience, Pacifism, Arrest, Stab Wound, Martial Law, Sphere of Safety. With that much protection except from maybe Hero's Downfall. You're practically safe with Gideon and you can set up for the K.O.
AnnoyingFogGuy
★★★★☆ (4.0/5.0)(1 vote)
Every time my friend ultimates this guy, I lose the game.
That said, this planeswalker has my grudging respect.
MGKetjak
★★☆☆☆ (2.5/5.0)(1 vote)
Are the extra counters of his +1 ability part of the payment for that ability? I'm wondering how Doubling Season treats them.
Mr.Freshness-Timmy
★★☆☆☆ (2.0/5.0)(1 vote)
Don't get me wrong I love this card, but have any of you actually found a viable way to use him in any format that's a little beyond casual? I've actually used him and this is what I found, please don't hate, this is only to people who are considering running this card.
The problem I see with his abilities are:
1) his + ability puts on 1 counter for each creature an OPPONENT controls. If i'm able to put 5 loyalty on him at once, my opponent has 5 guys, chances are they're tokens, at least 1/1 if not greater with all the token buffs around, and they're going to want a piece of gideon's face. If this ability was for a target player it would be much better since instead of defending poorly against tokens he'd work in a token deck or could be built around
2) his neutral ability is too similar to his old card. Nothing wrong with it and I like the variation with the loyalty, but holy hell I wish he lasted as a creature until your next turn. This way, he's not completely defenseless when your opponents decide to rip him limb from limb, and at the same time if you want to buff him, you'll have to be able to work with him and defend him from the hoards your opponents control
3) his ultimate is amazing. I love the flavour, I love how he can use near-death experience afterwards and win super flavourfully, but honestly, short of facing a weak token deck, or running doubling season or gilder bairn doubling shenanigans, how on earth are you ever going to get 15 counters on him? If there's a place for this guy it's in edh. And when people tend to have 3 creatures max before the board is swept that's 4-6 turns of sitting around with him untouched only using his first ability. How viable or realistic does that sound to you? If it was 10 I could understand, but 15 is a stretch. That's why people cheat emrakul into play. 15 mana is ridoncadonc.
These were just the flaws I noticed and felt could've been changed when I ran him in my ghave token edh with doubling season as well. I thought tokens would be able to defend him well/long enough to ultimate, but it doesn't work unless you're fighting token decks. Maybe then I would run him, but not everybody has a token deck sadly, so he can't build loyalty fast enough before eating sh!t. I was sad but I had to cut him.
On another note, if somebody makes a boros deck where they play forbidden orchard and other creature donation things and they make gideon huge and fling him for the win, I will exonerate you and give you 5 dollars and a congratulatory pat on the back and be happy for the rest of the day.
Thus concludes my experience with gideon champion of awkwardness. Peace Y
Pongdok
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
I put him in a deck that has a bunch of Wrath of God, Cataclysm and Jokulhaups type spells. I don't anticipate ever needing to use his final ability. Assemble the Legion is the typical win condition, but if Gideon's around, they will let him lend a hand. 4/5
IAmTheIceman
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
This guy has a great auxiliary purpose in a white/black tokens deck (if the following is allowed), here's how: Pump him for long enough with his +1 ability, then when the time's right, drop his 0 ability to turn him into a creature, enchant him with Murder Investigation , then sacrifice the poor guy with Devour Flesh. Instant craptons of Soldier tokens. Steamroll to win.
tastified
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
Make a fort of defenders. Have this guy be the king. Wrath, hit for game.
I would say a planeswalker that only fits in a certain deck is very good, but a planeswalker that needs a deck to be made after him is bad.
2/5
I just...idk. It has stuff going on but it doesn't do it for me.
I'd really love him to be at 5-6 mana and beefed way up. Something like
5 loyalty
+5 Creatures you control cannot attack this turn.
-2 Gideon deals damage to target creature equal to his loyalty
0: Until end of turn becomes a creature with power equal to loyalty, shroud, trample.
They expensive loyalty would mean he comes down late, but that's how you use him anyway, and this would make his a primary deck card, as opposed to a card you side in or out depending on how creature based the opposition's deck is.
The_AC
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
I've always liked this guy, and he helped me win a Game Day playmat yesterday.
He's good against aggro, since he can easily have 8 counters right when you play him, and he's good against control since he avoids sorcery speed removal.
Comments (96)
"Hah! I use his +1 to give him 6 loyalty counters!, next turn he's an 11 indestructible creature! Bet you're pretty scared, huh?"
*Opponent swings with his 6 creatures, kills Gideon, or even worse, kills you
It's a shame, given the original Gideon was so good...
0: Fight me!
-15: FOR GREAT JUSTICE
+1: Increase power level.
0: Starts fighting.
-15: Spirit Bomb.
It's a complete gamble: if they have 10 creatures, SURE, you could get 10 loyalty counters, but 1: how long is he going to survive, and 2: WHAT?! YOU LET THAT HAPPEN?!
How some think opponent could recover with 0 lands on board at something like turn 7-8 is beyond me.
About +1 and +0:
Yes he can't defend himself on opponents turn but he is a bomb that has to be dealt with immediately. Minimum 4/4 indestructible triggering batallion and accepting any other bonuses of creatures for the turn. What more do you want?!
Mana persists during phases.
Statement:
You can tap all your mana and have that much floating mana in your pool, then drop the -15 and exile everything and then spend the mana that YOU STILL HAVE IN YOUR MANA POOL. (likely 7 or 8 depending on the current turn / ramp and what not) Your opponent on the other hand just lost everything, literally.
Congrats, you essentially set the game back to turn 1 except you have a planeswalker and 7 - 8 mana to spend on turn 1. Now that is what I call an insanely defining advantage.
Question:
Why so much hate?
But well, his +1 doesn't really do anything to the board state besides threaten his ultimate, and his ultimate wipes the board and leaves him, but only as a really weak creature most of the time.
Also, there are all sorts of things that allow you to escape your own boardwipes. You could use Oblivion Ring, Detention Sphere, and Fiend Hunter to target some of your own creatures or permanents. If you splashed green for Thragtusk, that also works.
He actually fits blue/white or white/green Pillowfort decks quite well.
I view him as just a huge creature, seeing as how the +1 gives him more counters and the 0 turns him into an attacker. And the ultimate you almost never judge planeswalkers on. Thus I rate him compared to other 4 cmc creatures.
What kind of deck would want him? Any aggro boros deck would prefer hellrider. Naya would want huntmaster and/or restoration angel. Control decks don't want him because he can't do anything on defense unless your opponent willingly attacks into him. I can't imagine any sort of UW tempo would want him either.
I can't give 5 because 15 is a lot, and it's not for each opponent...but I had to read that first ability twice to make sure I was reading it right.
106.4. When an effect produces mana, that mana goes into a player's mana pool. From there, it can be used to pay costs immediately, or it can stay in the player's mana pool. Each player's mana pool empties at the end of each step and phase.
The previous Gideon wasn't indestructible, he just had the 'prevent all damage' clause.
I'm wondering if people just had too much trouble using him only to lose him to removal.
While I will admit, not exactly what everyone was expecting for the new Gideon, he could still see some use. As of a matter of fact, he cost 1 mana less than his counterpart, allowing him to come out and beef up with his +1 on the first turn he is out to have at least a 5/5 indestructible swinger on turn 5, which would be when old Gideon would have come out but couldn't attack using his 0 ability due to summoning sickness. Many people overlook this, as this Gideon works IMO better than the last one when it comes to their 0 ability. Sure, he doesn't have the great -2 the first Gideon had, but his +1 essentially says "Hit me before I get any bigger and blow up the field!", similar to old Gideon's taunt ability except not mandatory which was what I assume Wizard's was going for here. But enough of comparison's, Gideon 2.0 is not as splashable as 1.0, but can still find users to those who love vigilance (for being able to attack and protect Gideon), Walls (except no one really runs these) and control decks. People are also forgetting that his -15 is not mandatory. You don't have to sit and wait for his ultimate, as of a matter of fact, I rather swing with 15/15 indestructible than use his ultimate. His use goes with his 0 ability just like the last Gideon, except a turn earlier and can survive Doom Blade and Go for the Threat. So before giving him anything less than 3.5, consider his various uses rather than his seemingly one dismensionaltiy and comparisons to his former self.
(Note: By no means am I saying he is better than Gideon Jura, but he can still can contend as being a useful planewalkers just as much).
Observation: In my experience, if a Planeswalker card is not deemed as amazing on its debut then it receives a lukewarm reception at best.
Amused addendum: I find it fascinating as to how many of these Planeswalkers have mechanics that seem to yell "Kill me! Oh please lay your blades into my bulbous meatbag exterior!" Such pleading for self-destruction is both curious yet satisfying. Gideon in particular seems to excel in this overly immediate pleading for punishment. While I can undoubtedly agree with the pleasure in causing suffering upon others I cannot fathom why a meatbag would want to call such damage onto themselves. Most curious.
Faith's Reward won't work with him, if it did this would be a playable card... but it doesn't... so it's not....
Gideon: Ultimate...."You got served"
Was the original Gideon ever capable of animating himself to block?!?!?!?!?!??!?!?!?
But seriously, I'm not a huge fan. A Boros colored Gideon would have been more exciting.
I mean, maybe turbo fog? I just don't even want to use him in anything.
Yuck.
Ideally, you're left with both Gideon and something else, whereas your opponent is left with nothing. There is no coming back from this because he blows up lands, too. Avacyn won't protect you from him, either, because he exiles.
EDIT: Holy crap was I wrong about this guy. I built a UW tempo/control deck with him in it and he works wonders. Aggro will usually overextend to get at him so you can wipe the board next turn, and most control decks don't have a good way to deal with him so he becomes a very short clock. I haven't lost a single game where he hit the board.
5/5 Stars
Granted, that situation is not likely to come up often, but he's still a really good planeswalker, especially for multiplayer. If he isn't dealt with immediately, he will remain a constant threat from both his combat prowess and his looming ultimate.
RETURN TO RAVNICA......
RETURN TO RAVNICA.......
RAVNICA! HECK YEAH!
GIDEON's here, to save the motherhecking DAY, YEAH!
RAVNICA! HECK YEAH!
THE BOROS LEGION is the ONLY WAY, YEAH!
RAKDOS your sick games are THROUGH
Cause now you have to answer to,
AURELIA! HECK YEAH!
Simic can lick my butt, and suck my SURAL!
RAVNICA! HECK YEAH!
What you GONNA DO?!
WHEN WE MASSIVE RAIDYOU?!!
It’s the DREAM that we all SHARE!!!!
And NOT like the COMMIE-Tree-humping-Selesnya-"Worldsoul" SHARE!
(say that 5 hecking times hecking fast in rhythm)
It's the HOPE for TOMORROW!!!!
That's Tomorrow RIGHT NOW not AFTER ORZHOV TAX-ES!
HECK YEAH!
(hecking spoken)
BOROS CHARM! HECK YEAH!
BOROS GUILDMAGE! HECK YEAH!
BOROS RECKONER! HECK YEAH!
JARAD?!, HECK THAT!
BOROS GUILDGATE, HECK YEAH!
SACRED FOUNDRY, HECK YEAH!
ARROWS OF JUSTICE, HECK YEAH!
DETAIN?! HECK YEAH! WITH MORE FURY!
SZADEK?
WE HECKED HIM!
SUNHOME, HECK YEAH!
SKYKNIGHTS, HECK YEAH!
AGRUS KOS, HECK YEAH!
FLAME-KIN ZEALOT, HECK YEAH!
WOJEK VETERAN, HECK YEAH!
BOMBER CORPS, HECK YEAH!
BATTLE CRY, HECK YEAH!
BATTALLION, HECK YEAH!
ODRIC?! WE TAKE THE CREDIT!
LOAM LION, HECK YEAH!
KIRD APE (Heck yeah, Heck yeah)
GOBLINS! HECK YEAH!
ZOO! HECK YEAH!
ZUMOT! HECK YEAH!
HE'S BLUE BUT WHATEVER! :D
(hecking sung)
IT'S AM-ER-ICA! I MEAN RAV-NICA! ;)
LIGHTNING HELIX, HECK YEAH!
AJANI VENGEANT, HECK YEAH!
ASSEMBLE THE LEGION, HECK YEAH!
BOROS SIGNET, HECK YEAH!
RAZIA, HECK YEAH!
FIREMANE ANGEL, HECK YEAH!
GATECRASH, HECK YEAH!
BOROS KEYRUNE, HECK YEAH!
DARING SKYJEK, HECK YEAH!
FIREMANE AVENGER HECK YEAH!
(heck yeah, heck yeah)
Borborygmos?
HouseDimir?
Heck them.
I ran this guy in my Boros deck, and whenever I got him on the field that game was sealed in my favor. The key was using his +1 ability in a cumulative fashion similar to that of Assemble the Legion. It didn't take long to unleash him as a 10/10 indestructible human soldier that charged into battle with the rest of my Boros creatures, triggering a plethora of Battalions that my opponents could never answer.
5 out of 5, hands down.
0: DON'T WORRY I GOT THIS
-15: TAKE THIS! MY LOVE, ANGRY AND MY FURY!
(I'm sorry for getting the last one wrong xD)
Playing his ultimate might work well with free creatures, definitely aggro decks (a repeatable wrath of god that is also a creature?), and if your opponents have been using stuff like oblivion ring on your guys this version can save them...
To those who say it is only good in certain situations, I have to say that that is how people win - making the situation that favors them, so this card is like any other not as obviously beneficial card (maybe for instance Doran, Siege Tower).
If my memory is correct, there was a pro tour winning deck recently which recycled a single artifact doing 2 damage at a time, endlessly.
This seems to be a relatively easy card to work around, compared with something like Form of the Dragon, in my opinion. 5/5 for some very powerful abilities.
You noticed that to huh? He basically has an extra non-loyalty ability like Garruk Relentless that says, "Creatures your opponents control attack Gideon each combat if able." The really scary thing is that more often than not he can take it or at least that has been my expedience.
My Azorius EDH deck does. And while using his ultimate is devastating, so is getting 40+ counters on him when he lands and Aetherize-ing someone's insane token army.
He is totally awesome. just accept it.
@emilaeger: Yes he could but mana drains out of your pool at the end of each step so unless he had an instant, he couldn't use that mana for anything while it would still be your main phase so you could play anything.
He is both completely Planeswalker and completely Creature at the same time, and would be vulnerable to effects that check for either type. Dreadbore still won't kill him, though Geth's Verdict would. (Assuming he's the only creature on your opponent's board.)
I never play planeswalkers for their ultimate, it just seems risky and too often you won't get there. Gideon's +1 is just charging up. His 0 is more interesting, but we have seen this before. Most decks I would run him in I would rather have any number of big game ending bomb creatures.
What's worse, he shares a subtype with Gideon Jura, who is a pretty impressive planeswalker with similar abilities. On the bright side, 4 mana makes him relatively aggressive.
Most underwhelming planeswalker yet in my opinion.
+0 and attack if they have no or few creatures.
-15 if there is a massive stalemate.
He's not bad imo, but it's lame to remake gideon with similar, but weaker abilities. The old gideon would rock this guy. My guess is he used all his stamina on aurelia. And they weren't fighting either.
I love the design of Gideon but he's not right for this Standard. There's some neat tricks that can be used in casual or EDH but it's just hard to use him to his maximum potential.
This isn't true. The mana pool empties after each phase change. However, I don't see what's wrong with tapping all land, activating ultimate, then playing cards all in main phase 1.
It's gonna be a long time before they block that Worldspine Wurm...
Also, using Evil Twin on Gideon would be hilarious because it still has its ability to destroy things (and it's even a copyable characteristic) but the only times when Gideon is a valid target he's also indestructible. Also, I wonder - if you copy a planeswalker like this, could the copy planeswalk? "Ohey, I'm Gideon now. Cool. Brb exploring multiverse. Good luck bro!"
The deck I have around him right now is straight forward Azorius human deck, based on board wipes and battlefield medic's to keep my creature count higher than theirs. It doesn't happen very often, but my favorite thing to do is planar cleansing letting all my creatures die. Next turn tap all my mana and Gideon's ultimate. Play Angel of Glory's Rise
There is no kill sweeter than overkill.
When I play Gideon and my opponent has 2 creatures, I activate his +1 and I get +1 loyalty and +2 for the creatures, totaling +3 loyalty same turn he is played and making him +7 total LP.
On the second turn, if there are still just 2 opponent creatures on the battlefield, and I activate his +1 again... Do I get +3 loyalty this time too, even if it is the same 2 opponent creatures??
3.5/5 because he's not very flexible.
I'd like him if he chose a goal and stuck to it, like Venser, Koth, Karn, Urza or even Tamiyo.
That said, this planeswalker has my grudging respect.
The problem I see with his abilities are:
1) his + ability puts on 1 counter for each creature an OPPONENT controls. If i'm able to put 5 loyalty on him at once, my opponent has 5 guys, chances are they're tokens, at least 1/1 if not greater with all the token buffs around, and they're going to want a piece of gideon's face. If this ability was for a target player it would be much better since instead of defending poorly against tokens he'd work in a token deck or could be built around
2) his neutral ability is too similar to his old card. Nothing wrong with it and I like the variation with the loyalty, but holy hell I wish he lasted as a creature until your next turn. This way, he's not completely defenseless when your opponents decide to rip him limb from limb, and at the same time if you want to buff him, you'll have to be able to work with him and defend him from the hoards your opponents control
3) his ultimate is amazing. I love the flavour, I love how he can use near-death experience afterwards and win super flavourfully, but honestly, short of facing a weak token deck, or running doubling season or gilder bairn doubling shenanigans, how on earth are you ever going to get 15 counters on him? If there's a place for this guy it's in edh. And when people tend to have 3 creatures max before the board is swept that's 4-6 turns of sitting around with him untouched only using his first ability. How viable or realistic does that sound to you? If it was 10 I could understand, but 15 is a stretch. That's why people cheat emrakul into play. 15 mana is ridoncadonc.
These were just the flaws I noticed and felt could've been changed when I ran him in my ghave token edh with doubling season as well. I thought tokens would be able to defend him well/long enough to ultimate, but it doesn't work unless you're fighting token decks. Maybe then I would run him, but not everybody has a token deck sadly, so he can't build loyalty fast enough before eating sh!t. I was sad but I had to cut him.
On another note, if somebody makes a boros deck where they play forbidden orchard and other creature donation things and they make gideon huge and fling him for the win, I will exonerate you and give you 5 dollars and a congratulatory pat on the back and be happy for the rest of the day.
Thus concludes my experience with gideon champion of awkwardness. Peace Y
I would say a planeswalker that only fits in a certain deck is very good, but a planeswalker that needs a deck to be made after him is bad.
2/5
I just...idk. It has stuff going on but it doesn't do it for me.
I'd really love him to be at 5-6 mana and beefed way up. Something like
5 loyalty
+5 Creatures you control cannot attack this turn.
-2 Gideon deals damage to target creature equal to his loyalty
0: Until end of turn becomes a creature with power equal to loyalty, shroud, trample.
They expensive loyalty would mean he comes down late, but that's how you use him anyway, and this would make his a primary deck card, as opposed to a card you side in or out depending on how creature based the opposition's deck is.
He's good against aggro, since he can easily have 8 counters right when you play him, and he's good against control since he avoids sorcery speed removal.