But you know what...... just use Bloodchief Ascension. I think that'll work out just fine.
scumbling1
★★★★☆ (4.1/5.0)(7 votes)
The combo is alright, but the card is worse than mediorce otherwise. If you're playing a mill deck, you'll be minimizing the amount of damage sources in your deck as they don't contribute to your overall strategy. Mindcrank can turn damage sources into mill, but if you don't see it early you have a bunch of cards that are essentially dead without it. This forces a lot of unwarranted inconsistency into a deck.
PhyrexianFryCook
★★★★☆ (4.4/5.0)(4 votes)
This can make your Bonehoard pretty fat pretty quick. Combine with a Geth, Lord of the Vault for some really silly graveyard hijinks.
MasterOfEtherium
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.5/5.0)(3 votes)
that Art is Sick this with bloodchief str8 CRACK
BALDOF
★☆☆☆☆ (1.0/5.0)(3 votes)
Cool with bonehoard or that kind of stuff... completely useless otherwise.
ZeroSheep
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
I like this card for a mill deck, because it turns any normal creature into a milling machine, or it can make your Screeching Silcaw mill even more cards. If you've got slots in your deck, it's nice, it's early, and it's cheap. 3.5/5
thepekay
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
People, this is a card to be used with a bloodchief, or graveyard-related cards. This is NOT a mill card, if you can mill out enough cards with this artifact for it to be effective, why aren't you just beating your opponent by pure damage? Mill decks are not aggro decks.
Boakes2047
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
2 mana artifact? Throw this in ANY beat down deck for advantage.
This makes life gain decks with no protection from milling useless.
Zuriga_Sungama
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
@thepekay "Mill decks are not aggro decks." Tell that to Dimir.
Turn 3: Swamp. Grim Affliction. Proliferate the counter. Swing with Pulse Tracker/swing with or sacrifice Death Cultist. Ends the turn with three quest counters on Bloodchief Ascension hopefully.
Turn 4: This little beast here. Any mill, discard, or removal of your choice.
auriscope
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
Note that if you're not comboing out with Bloodchief Ascension or actually trying to deck them, there's absolutely no advantage to having this out simply for beating on them. It's total luck whether you mill their answers or mill them into their answers. Shriekhorns also suffered from this in MBC limited unless you were using them to enable metalcraft, beating someone over the head with 5/5 Shriekhorns, or making a dedicated mill deck.
WateryMind
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.5/5.0)(2 votes)
This + Rage Extractor + Moltensteel Dragon/ Slash Panther/ any Phyrexain mana card = PAIN.
Telltalereaper
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.5/5.0)(1 vote)
Missing something very important, everyone who says it's less than mediocre...you're not going to win with this card outside of a bloodchief deck, that's for sure...but in a regular aggro deck, ur gaining serious card advantage. 1/3 of the average deck will be milled by the time you win...possibly taking away their win conditions, or that one card they needed to turn the game around. For two mana, it doesn't even really take away from a deck...hell, make a 61 card deck!
blindthrall
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
YES. I've got a {G}{U}{R} Ally deck that switches between early aggro into late mill Halimar Excavator. It's really disorienting to have to deal with an entirely different strategy halfway through the game. It's wonky and completely unexpected, and this is perfect.
FrostyMarvin
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
As if mill wasn't already possible in limited environments, they print this. If you'd happen to snag 2-3 copies through the NPH pack, you can probably get a playset of Shriekhorn to play with it during the MBS pack. With a creature or two with evasion, and some good removal, you'll mill them fast enough.
Selez
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
While clearly best in the format with the smallest deck size, Mindcrank remains a non-pick. It's the kind of card you pick late because it's there and might end up running if you find some other millers in subsequent packs. And honestly, even that isn't very likely. Don't waste an early pick on it, even if you want it; it should table. Be aware also that Scars draft is going to speed up with New Phyrexia, so any plan you had of milling your slow opponent out is unlikely to come to fruition.
with mind crank and the new phyrexia mana when you pay life does that count as loosing life as far as the wording is concerned? Because me an my friend disagree paying is different than loosing.
infernox10
★★★★☆ (4.8/5.0)(2 votes)
Everyone talks about how unreliable the Bloodchief Ascension combo is.
Well, that's why you put cognitive thought into your deck space.
Throw in normal discard. Throw in normal black removal. Throw in some great creatures that can help get the ascension up, and proliferate to help pump it up.
Hell, put in Surgical Extraction with the discard so you can get rid of the threats that could destroy you or the combo.
The Ascension is a one-drop, this is a two-drop, which is a beautiful, low curve,
Which means they are not by any means "in the way" of the entire deckspace.
If you get this card out without the Ascension, you're beginning your mill strategy early, maybe even exiling the cards you least wish to see.
If you have the Ascension out, you're beggining the life loss strategy.
The point I'm trying to make is simple: the combo is powerful, and the deck that is built to support the combo will definitely show how much it shines.
Shiizu
★★★☆☆ (3.8/5.0)(2 votes)
It doesn't look like much, but in a draft a shrine of burning rage at 8 and suddenly a second of these looked pretty lethal! And he finished me with some burn, only burning me for 13 overall, but milling me completely! It may not be the sweetest card ever, but in draft it was quite competent.
Gavrilo
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.7/5.0)(3 votes)
I can't get it. This card does nothing in any deck, with bloodchief ascension or without it. Life loss kills twice as fast, so why waste slot on this crap when you can put some countermagic or removal that'll actually contribute to decks engine instead?
MindAblaze
★★☆☆☆ (2.8/5.0)(2 votes)
@ Noctemundi
...indeed.
afellowgatherer
★★★★☆ (4.5/5.0)(3 votes)
This may not be the best for a straight mill deck, but I have found it very helpful in my reanimation deck based around Geth, Lord of the Vault and Rise from the Grave.
blugrn1989
★★★★☆ (4.5/5.0)(5 votes)
I'm gonna run this in my counterburn - should screw with everybody.
EDIT:
Wow, was I right. It effectively turned my counterburn deck into a nice little mill engine. My friend was playing R/W heal+burn, and when this came out it really put the screws on him... and then I locked him down with an Everlasting Torment. I like how they stack too...
A great choice for any damage-heavy deck in need of a solid 2-drop.
Discard 4... loses 8 life... put 8 cards in graveyard...
8 damage & 12 cards gone (just for dropping in)
bluemaxx
★★★★☆ (4.0/5.0)(2 votes)
the way i see it, this card discourages you to play infect. surprising that this came out in 'New Phyrexia'
Aqualightnin
★★★★☆ (4.0/5.0)(5 votes)
everyone seems to be missing where this card shines best (other than obvious combo with bloodchief) - multiplayer. especially in casual groups who play large group games often where everyone has tons of lifegain to survive 4+ player games. in our group of players this does wonders. sure playerX over there may have 185 life now and gaining 35 life a turn, but thanks to my two mindcranks i just dropped on the field we can deck him and ignore his lifegain.
even better with team games if everyone in the team has some... 1 or 2 down may seem lacking, however 4 or 5 on the field (which wont be too uncommon in 2 or 3 player teams) can really change things if your primary win conditions have failed.
not saying its amazing, but when you can play a card that helps your opponents hurt each other more in a free for all, its almost always a win in my book :)
dberry02
★★★★☆ (4.8/5.0)(4 votes)
CONS: The problem I see with Mindcrank is that you need multiple out to really benefit. If you deal 20 damage to your opponent, sure you mill them 20, but most likely they will be dead from the damage itself. So by itself, this card is pretty weak.
PROS: I have read pretty much the same comments on Jace's Erasure. There are a lot better cards out there for direct mill. But what these two cards provide you is a way to "set it and forget it." These two cards essentially allow you to invest in the mill without having to constatly tap out each turn. They allow you to play the game and cast other spells, while still keeping the mill threat there.
You could combo this card with something like Underworld Dreams. Even if they're able to resist and survive the damage, the mill will still be an active threat to them. But like I said earlier, one mindcrank by itself is still kinda weak.
Overall I give this card a solid 3.5/5. I believe it'll let casual Johnny players find new and interesting ways to mill your opponents.
shmewdog
★★★☆☆ (3.5/5.0)(1 vote)
OK so just for humors sake, let's say you're playing multiplayer. You have four of these out alongside four Psychosis Crawler. You draw one card, each opponent loses 4 life, then each is forced to mill 16! Draw 3 more and thats good game in all likelihood.
lildragon79
★★★★☆ (4.2/5.0)(3 votes)
does mindcrank stack?
like if you have more than one in play. plz help!
helluin
★★★★☆ (4.2/5.0)(3 votes)
Those of you criticizing Mindcrank as an inefficient mill engine aren't getting it at all. Even if you don't plan on milling them to death, this card can be very good.
It's great if you have a deck designed to feed off your opponent's graveyard. Unless they have a deck designed to pull from their grave, you've also got a decent chance of disrupting a combo. If they've just done something to put the card they need on top of their library, ping 'em for a point and get rid of it.
Use your imagination people! A card doesn't have to fit in every single deck concept to be good.
WiggleWurm
★★★☆☆ (3.0/5.0)(2 votes)
Used with Dash Hopes makes a very difficult decision for your opponent.
LordofAwesome33
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
A buddy of mine introduced me to how annoying this card is. I'm throwing a few copies in my Shaman Burn Deck.
zombierob
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
I was just wondering wouldnt mindcrank work well with Liliana's caress.
Maybe not the best card ever seen, but in casual can be good. I play Blue-Black deck (not entirely mill deck) and when I have this out and my Skaab Goliath is swinging, it can speed up a game. And look on my brother's face when all his Cruel Ultimatums lied in his graveyard was really rewarding.
Mill doesn't have to be a win condition by itself, guys. What this does is populate their graveyard, which is handy, as well as potentially remove a lot of threats early game, also handy.
Plus, it's colorless, which means your Ball Lightning can become an absolute monster.
Elenodul
★★★☆☆ (3.5/5.0)(3 votes)
Combo with Bloodchief' Ascension for the quickest way to lose friends!
TheWrathofShane
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.5/5.0)(1 vote)
In my opinion, you should only focus on 1 win condition. I dont like cards that want to win with both mill and damage, and this is one of them.
Duskmantle Guildm... dammit, ShimmerVoid, you beat me to the punch.
Aside from a lethal combo like this, or in conjunction with Rest in Peace or something similar, its usefulness seems limited.
Sky8Palefur
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.5/5.0)(3 votes)
This is why this card should be banned Duskmantle Guildmage Whenever a card is put into an opponent's graveyard from anywhere this turn, that player loses 1 life. Now... think about the wording.
Mind Crank Whenever an opponent loses life, that player puts that many cards from the top of his or her library into his or her graveyard.
This meaning Duskmantle Guildmage active you use even 1 card on the person with the ability used the person is dead How is plays on stack 1 life hit Mind Crank does one card Duskmantle Guildmage does 1 life Mind Crank does one card Etc etc etc till either no cards or no life.
Further more Hedron Crab All you need to do is have a land fall then pay the 3 for Duskmantle Guildmage ability with the 2 cost Mind Crank
Nothing taps and Abilities stack for the one land falling or using scour. Please fix this with banning this card.
Tmbstone
★★★★☆ (4.8/5.0)(2 votes)
Calm down people! There is NO NEED for a banning on this card. Yes this combos nicely with Duskmantle Guildmage, but it can also be hated out fairly easily. Artifact destruction? Check. Creature removal? Check. Hand disruption? Check. Graveyard hate? Check, check, and double check! A Rest in Peace, Leyline of the Void, or Wheel of Sun and Moon neuters this combo quite efficiently. Besides, this is just slower than other combo decks out there... I'm looking at you Storm. So for all those players calling for a banning with spittle flying, just chill. There is a lot of answers that are already being used in the sideboards of current modern decks. If this kind of deck does rise up and snags a win somewhere, sideboards will be adjusted and the menace will fade to the background. This is not the broken deck you think it is!!!
This card and Bloodchief's Ascension are brutal in Archenemy. I run this in a mono-Black deck with multiples of Sign in Blood, Underworld Dreams, Bump in the Night, and a suite of discard spells that work to disrupt my opponents' game plans. It also features Quest for the Nihil Stone and Painful Quandary to add to the pressure. Just don't play it in a free-for-all, you will draw a lot of aggro/hate from the rest of the table.
As for the combo with Duskmantle Guildmage, I have been evaluating it for some time, and I don't see it going off frequently in Modern. Whereas the Ascension takes longer time, it is less prone to removal outside of matches against Green and White. The Guildmage, however, can be targeted by cards like Arrest or otherwise bounced, destroyed, or Pithing Needle'd. The fact that it shares a CMC with the crank means it doesn't curve out well. My estimate, without any mana ramp from artifact sources, is that you would need 5 turns or more to successfully pull off. It would take a large degree of patience to set up, and your guildmage is going to see lots of hatred the moment it hits the table.
Lastly, the combo runs into a snag anytime a player is running Red, Blue, or Green because they have a very impressive array of cards that deal with opposing artifacts. The 'crank sees a lot of decks side in Naturalize.
In short, there is no reason to ban or otherwise limit this card or the guildmage. The clock they present towards opponents is quite long by most standards and each threat has multiple cards in format to answer them.
If you want an efficient mill combo off of this card simply combine it with duskmantle guildmage. If you want a mill combo for free for all variants throw Consuming Aberration into that.
MockingJ
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
you put it with duskmantle guildmage and you win
RetroGamer3
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
One card with it Lazav, Dimir Mastermind. Very fun combo in EDH with Laz as your commander.
These new toys work well with it; they get huge very fast.
sincleanser
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
Alt wincon for Extort?
TheDouce
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
Really, ban this card because of one combo. That is absurd (saying that i must admit i use that combo in an EDH deck) it's not that bad. It's not any worse than Serra Ascendant in an EDH game. If you can't figure out a way to stop that combo TS for you. If you ban this then you might as well ban Time Sieve because you can combo it with Thopter Assembly for infinite turns. Also in a Two-Headed Giant game does this mill both players or do you choose one?
Daxos_of_Meletis
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
So, what exactly is the thing on the card? I don't mean the crank itself, but what is being used on. My guess is a leonine stripped of it's mane, but I'm curious to hear what others think.
LordOfTheFlies87
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
It's a combo-piece. Dirty.
Enelysios
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
Just because a combo is infinite doesn't mean it is broken. As we can all see by the fact that Mindcrank + Duskmantle Guildmage has not appeared in any competitive format. I have to giggle at all the people crying for bannings (I assume when the guildmage was first announced.)
Maybe someone could make it work for modern? The whole thing seems too slow. Pay to get this out, to get the mage out, then to activate its ability and then you have to hit them with something to start the process. Vintage formats have Painter's Servant + Grindstone which is a similar, but far better combo in colorless. That doesn't even show up.
Rifts980
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
I've ran this in my Jarad edh for a few months now, and out of a deck filled with entomb/exhume, deadbridge chant, broken dredge shenanigans, lord of extinction and more, THIS is the absolute most hated card in my entire deck, and has everyone in my personal meta adding recursion. I've had my friends scoop several times after milling out their win cons/shit that would help/recursion.
I couldn't love this card more if I wanted to. It can be useful and made for a quick game with a turn 4 lord of extinction wearing a prowler's helm, vulturous zombie can also get big, goes infinite with bloodcheif and Duskmantle Guildmage, but that's missing the main appeal of this card. It's salt-in-the-wound, unessacarily cruel and just silly all at the same time. Will it ever mill anyone out? Probably never, but it gives no fucks, you loose that life AND those cards!
This card is just a delight to play and any time I can resolve it, it brightens my day. If you run an EDH that deals damage, give this card a try, you won't regret it.
Comments (65)
In Allies running Blue for pain in baht milling ally to not be annoying in multiplayer,
AND with Vulturous Zombie so he can double himself like the big boy Szadek, Lord of Secrets and you can (probably) reanimate stuff!!!!!..................
But you know what...... just use Bloodchief Ascension. I think that'll work out just fine.
This is NOT a mill card, if you can mill out enough cards with this artifact for it to be effective, why aren't you just beating your opponent by pure damage?
Mill decks are not aggro decks.
This makes life gain decks with no protection from milling useless.
Tell that to Dimir.
Turn 1:
Swamp.
Pulse Tracker.
Turn 2:
Swamp.
Bloodchief Ascension.
Death Cultist?
Swing with Pulse Tracker and hope fully cause a loss of two life for the first counter.
Turn 3:
Swamp.
Grim Affliction. Proliferate the counter.
Swing with Pulse Tracker/swing with or sacrifice Death Cultist.
Ends the turn with three quest counters on Bloodchief Ascension hopefully.
Turn 4:
This little beast here.
Any mill, discard, or removal of your choice.
Turn 1: Mountain, Goblin Guide (Doesn't help the combo first turn. Blackcleave Cliffs along with Vampire Lacerator or Pulse Tracker works too).
Turn 2: Swamp, Bloodchief Ascension, swing (counter 1). On their turn, Lightning Bolt (counter 2)
Turn 3: Land, Swing (counter 3), Mindcrank. At the start of their next turn, Bolt/Burst Lightning.
To make it at least somewhat useful outside of the combo, maybe Surgical Extraction and Haunting Echoes.
"Oh, just my new R/B mill deck."
"-pff- Yeah, ok, good luck with that."
Well, that's why you put cognitive thought into your deck space.
Throw in normal discard. Throw in normal black removal. Throw in some great creatures that can help get the ascension up, and proliferate to help pump it up.
Hell, put in Surgical Extraction with the discard so you can get rid of the threats that could destroy you or the combo.
The Ascension is a one-drop, this is a two-drop, which is a beautiful, low curve,
Which means they are not by any means "in the way" of the entire deckspace.
If you get this card out without the Ascension, you're beginning your mill strategy early, maybe even exiling the cards you least wish to see.
If you have the Ascension out, you're beggining the life loss strategy.
The point I'm trying to make is simple: the combo is powerful, and the deck that is built to support the combo will definitely show how much it shines.
It may not be the sweetest card ever, but in draft it was quite competent.
...indeed.
EDIT:
Wow, was I right. It effectively turned my counterburn deck into a nice little mill engine. My friend was playing R/W heal+burn, and when this came out it really put the screws on him... and then I locked him down with an Everlasting Torment. I like how they stack too...
A great choice for any damage-heavy deck in need of a solid 2-drop.
3 damage & Discard 2... loses 4 life... put 4 cards in graveyard...
7 damage & 6 cards gone
or Bloodhusk Ritualist and a good kicker (say 4)
Discard 4... loses 8 life... put 8 cards in graveyard...
8 damage & 12 cards gone (just for dropping in)
even better with team games if everyone in the team has some... 1 or 2 down may seem lacking, however 4 or 5 on the field (which wont be too uncommon in 2 or 3 player teams) can really change things if your primary win conditions have failed.
not saying its amazing, but when you can play a card that helps your opponents hurt each other more in a free for all, its almost always a win in my book :)
The problem I see with Mindcrank is that you need multiple out to really benefit. If you deal 20 damage to your opponent, sure you mill them 20, but most likely they will be dead from the damage itself. So by itself, this card is pretty weak.
PROS:
I have read pretty much the same comments on Jace's Erasure. There are a lot better cards out there for direct mill. But what these two cards provide you is a way to "set it and forget it." These two cards essentially allow you to invest in the mill without having to constatly tap out each turn. They allow you to play the game and cast other spells, while still keeping the mill threat there.
You could combo this card with something like Underworld Dreams. Even if they're able to resist and survive the damage, the mill will still be an active threat to them. But like I said earlier, one mindcrank by itself is still kinda weak.
Overall I give this card a solid 3.5/5. I believe it'll let casual Johnny players find new and interesting ways to mill your opponents.
like if you have more than one in play. plz help!
It's great if you have a deck designed to feed off your opponent's graveyard. Unless they have a deck designed to pull from their grave, you've also got a decent chance of disrupting a combo. If they've just done something to put the card they need on top of their library, ping 'em for a point and get rid of it.
Use your imagination people! A card doesn't have to fit in every single deck concept to be good.
Plus, it's colorless, which means your Ball Lightning can become an absolute monster.
I predict this will be ban, or the guildmage, buut more likely this because the guildmage is otherwise nothing.
Aside from a lethal combo like this, or in conjunction with Rest in Peace or something similar, its usefulness seems limited.
Duskmantle Guildmage Whenever a card is put into an opponent's graveyard from anywhere this turn, that player loses 1 life. Now... think about the wording.
Mind Crank Whenever an opponent loses life, that player puts that many cards from the top of his or her library into his or her graveyard.
This meaning Duskmantle Guildmage active you use even 1 card on the person with the ability used the person is dead How is plays on stack 1 life hit Mind Crank does one card
Duskmantle Guildmage does 1 life Mind Crank does one card Etc etc etc till either no cards or no life.
Further more Hedron Crab All you need to do is have a land fall then pay the 3 for Duskmantle Guildmage ability with the 2 cost Mind Crank
Nothing taps and Abilities stack for the one land falling or using scour. Please fix this with banning this card.
Enuf said.
As for the combo with Duskmantle Guildmage, I have been evaluating it for some time, and I don't see it going off frequently in Modern. Whereas the Ascension takes longer time, it is less prone to removal outside of matches against Green and White. The Guildmage, however, can be targeted by cards like Arrest or otherwise bounced, destroyed, or Pithing Needle'd. The fact that it shares a CMC with the crank means it doesn't curve out well. My estimate, without any mana ramp from artifact sources, is that you would need 5 turns or more to successfully pull off. It would take a large degree of patience to set up, and your guildmage is going to see lots of hatred the moment it hits the table.
Lastly, the combo runs into a snag anytime a player is running Red, Blue, or Green because they have a very impressive array of cards that deal with opposing artifacts. The 'crank sees a lot of decks side in Naturalize.
In short, there is no reason to ban or otherwise limit this card or the guildmage. The clock they present towards opponents is quite long by most standards and each threat has multiple cards in format to answer them.
Very fun combo in EDH with Laz as your commander.
Wight of Precinct Six
These new toys work well with it; they get huge very fast.
Maybe someone could make it work for modern? The whole thing seems too slow. Pay
I couldn't love this card more if I wanted to. It can be useful and made for a quick game with a turn 4 lord of extinction wearing a prowler's helm, vulturous zombie can also get big, goes infinite with bloodcheif and Duskmantle Guildmage, but that's missing the main appeal of this card. It's salt-in-the-wound, unessacarily cruel and just silly all at the same time. Will it ever mill anyone out? Probably never, but it gives no fucks, you loose that life AND those cards!
This card is just a delight to play and any time I can resolve it, it brightens my day. If you run an EDH that deals damage, give this card a try, you won't regret it.
5/5 just for being an absolute joy to play.