In order to make YawgWin fair, they had to more than double the cost.
lordtian
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
Too bad its 8 mana. Best decks I can think of for this one are ones that ramp and play a ton of instant/ sorcery . Valakut maybe.
However, I am very fond of the venser's journal idea. Imagine the games lasted for 40 mins already and you're now gaining 30 life per turn against a control deck, heck they might even mill themselves out before they're able to kill you if you just don't play any cards.
Amnatto
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
... Must have one for every deck that can possibly support it! I would run this over half the mythics in standard in at least two of my decks
Kryptnyt
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
"Hey Karn. Guess what. Me and Ph'dingeer are going to Sheetz, and YOU can't come! Ahahaha." Why they stuck this in green is beyond me, unless they were afraid of someone breaking it. I'd say if it were red (pyretic ritual? Koth? lol) or blue (Tome Scour and Hedron Crab self) it would be a lot stronger. A lot of my standard legal green decks don't fill the graveyard much at all. Potential for a blue/green deck is pretty strong. CONCLUSION; this card was printed solely with EDH in mind. Dredge and dredge. And more dredge. and Sins of the past. and some dredge.
Archiphres
★★☆☆☆ (2.4/5.0)(4 votes)
Yawgwin with a high mana cost is still Yawgwin. You can still get your combo and dark rituals back to set it off again, just for a much trickier cost. With stuff like Primeval Titan floating around in standard, and big stompy colorless Eldrazi providing an invitation for a ramp deck in green, I wonder how long it will be before someone breaks this.
And what about legacy blue control decks? The ones which already often splash green to use tarmogoyf as their finisher? Having just one of these in their decks means they get all four Force of Wills back late in the game, ready to defend their goyfs from any real threat. Call me a pessimist, but this might just get hit with the banhammer, if someone takes it to its full potential.
Vividice
★★☆☆☆ (2.3/5.0)(6 votes)
Nice for Casual Rock Decks especially in Multiplayer. Beside that... CMC8 for anything that doesn't outright wins is too much, even for green.
ROBRAM89
★★★★☆ (4.1/5.0)(7 votes)
Anybody complaining about this card's cost has failed to realize that 1) it's freaking green and 2) it's designed to be put into a deck where you have enough resources to recast your entire graveyard.
A0602
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
It has a spot waiting for it in my Dream Fracture cantrip deck.
mlanier131
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
This card will be played in valakut, with lotus cobra this thing is playable quickly and you get all your fetch lands back creating unheard of amounts if mana to drop blightsteel or eldrazis quite fast.
Completely insane in pretty much any green EDH deck.
GruesomeGoo
★★★☆☆ (3.8/5.0)(7 votes)
Shouldn't it read, "You get an emblem that has 'You have no maximum hand size'" Also, is that a Hydralisk in the art?
Keiya
★★★★☆ (4.1/5.0)(6 votes)
@Keino: There's no need for an emblem on this card because it doesn't affect any permanents on the battlefield or add a special effect to whenever you take a specific action (see: Venser, the Sojourner). That and I think Wizards wants emblems to be specifically for Planeswalkers.
made4ipod
★★★☆☆ (3.9/5.0)(5 votes)
Another green mythic I really need.
Shiny_Umbreon
★★★★☆ (4.5/5.0)(2 votes)
I think someone already mentioned it, but I'm more afraid of Legacy. Yes, eight mana, so I may be exaggerating, but I do think this could be played in Legacy, just not sure how.
I REALLY want to see insane vintage plays with this card. Yes, it's like Yawgmoth's will, but without the drawback of exiling cards in your graveyard. However, there are no great ways of reliably cheating sorceries into play: Djinn of Wishes the slower Jhoria Spellweaver Helix possibly with Buried Alive Sins of the Past with Intuition/Gifts the newly printed Galvanoth Wrexial or Maelstrom Archangel, but what are you doing with that kind of mana in the first place anyways? Kaho might be possible to tutor up without actually dipping into green (though you might still need lotus cobra in Gush decks). Or just hope you can flip it at random Hellcarver Demon and Mind's Desire?!.
My favorites are Hideaway lands, especially Shelldock Isle, which has great synergy with you milling yourself. It'll be tricky to stack your top cards, though.
Overall, though, the cost might just be too high
Pwnsaw
★★★★☆ (4.8/5.0)(4 votes)
Its like an infinite for one. I really like this as a one-of in ramp decks. The sheer value this builds is often back breaking.
I'm struggling to figure out why this doesn't belong in blue or black. How the heck did green end up with this nonsense? It's the exact opposite of blue and black. It make no sense.
PhyrexianAdvocate
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.7/5.0)(3 votes)
.
A3Kitsune
★★★★☆ (4.5/5.0)(3 votes)
@zerosavant:
Blue and black get "return a card of a certain type from your graveyard to your hand" effects. "Return any card you want, of any type, from your graveyard to your hand" is something green gets.
The effects of this card and YawgWin are pretty much the same. However, 5 more mana is not simply just 5 more mana. One important aspect that made Yawgmoth's Will into Yawgmoth's Win is that the caster won before the game started being a game- the level of interaction was minimal unless the opponent had metagamed accordingly. In terms of play-this-card-and-win, for one more mana there was already Tooth and Nail (coincidentally in the former Mirrodin Block).
Praetor's Counsel is more widely useful than Tooth 'n' Nail in my opinion; and yes, a resolved Praetor's Counsel will most likely mean that whoever casted it is about to win.
I also do believe that the potency of this spell, unlike pretty much any other sorcery that I've seen, is Vintage worthy... if you can keep your opponent from killing you on turn two and if you can keep this spell from being countered.
The necessity of graveyard hate in EDH has now increased tremendously. I will need two find a few more good colorless gy-hating cards to recommend to non-green, non-black, non-blue EDH players, because this card can be really bad news if some stupid control deck resolves this. I HIGHLY discourage running this in EDH if you are a follower of my arcane deck building practices- even before this card came out people were running Knowledge Exploitation all over the place.
infernox10
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
Actually, the best examples of how this fits green rather than blue (draw) and black (tutor/creature from gy) is a recent print: Nature's Spiral.
For an older version, one that I love in my EDH, look at Eternal Witness.
dragonking987
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.5/5.0)(1 vote)
not as good as Yawgmoth's Will power leek. While the power leek thing is a Joke seriously come up with real arguments about the new sets being broken not pointing at the best cards from new sets and comparing them to some of the weaker ones from old sets.
Get a psychosis crawler out, mill your self for 20 plus, drop hand of the praetor, distortion Strike for lethal. Might be fun hahaha
Polychromatic
★★★☆☆ (3.7/5.0)(6 votes)
I want to see someone break this card so badly.
--
Away I go, to another Random Card.
djbon2112
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
@GruesomeGoo: It doesn't need one. Something specifying hand size "for the rest of the game" works, because that's not something that usually changes. The memory required for that is minimal. Emblems came about from a problem with Elspeth's original wording: "For the rest of the game, permanents are indestructable" doesn't work the same way hand size does, because permanents enter and leave the battlefield all the time. So for rules reasons, the emblem was created for PW ultimates that grant you some "special ability" for the rest of the game.
Nayban
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
Kinda wanna try a Green blue deck using Tramatize, this and Venser's Journal, to outlive an opponent. lol cheap but Ive never tried a deck like that.
Hero40
★★★★★ (5.0/5.0)(2 votes)
Yeah, I'm happy to say I was one of the first to combine this with Psychosis Crawler . I pulled both during the release tournament, and won with it 3 times (or at least made the diffreence between winning and losing). However, I would recommend if you know someone who has it, throw a couple Nihil Spellbomb into yourdeck. Cheap colorless Graveyard destroyers would make this card useless.
Ideatog
★★★☆☆ (3.7/5.0)(10 votes)
WHY doesn't this give you an emblem!? Isn't that what they started this whole dumb emblem thing for? Are emblems restricted to planeswalker cards only? >_<
krauser-gogetthegirl
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
i was alittle disappointed when i pulled this. then i combined it with destructive force, primeval titan, explores, and other fun instants and sorcery's. i call it: Forceful Counsel ha ha
Paleopaladin
★★★☆☆ (3.9/5.0)(11 votes)
I don't care about bureaucratic excuse of "Only planeswalkers can create emblems!" This needed to create a damn emblem!!!
Vinifera7
★★☆☆☆ (2.8/5.0)(5 votes)
This is the only card since Stigma Lasher that has "until the end of the game" printed on it. I was under the impression that WotC implemented emblems for this purpose.
Gabriel422
★★☆☆☆ (2.0/5.0)(3 votes)
You get an emblem named Spellbook with "you have no maximum hand size".
E-n-S
★☆☆☆☆ (1.6/5.0)(4 votes)
We did they stop using the phrase "You get an Emblem" after Mirrodin Besieged?
Crag-Hack
★★★★☆ (4.9/5.0)(11 votes)
Regrowth attached to a Spell Book infused with a large volume of steroids.
nic56
★★★★☆ (4.5/5.0)(4 votes)
This card is pretty cool in EDH with Jin Gitaxias. You can end up with half of your deck in your hand!
Emblems aren't so the players can remember something: They're so the game rules can remember something. If you'd like, you can still just write "no maximum hand size" on a scrap of paper. Or, for that matter, when you do create an emblem, you can just remember that you have it, without needing an actual physical object.
The game rules didn't need to remember anything for this one, so it didn't need an emblem, so they didn't make it with an emblem.
Magic-Master
★★☆☆☆ (2.8/5.0)(2 votes)
Perhaps going to get very good in innistrad, a graveyard set.
Arachibutyrophobia
★★★★☆ (4.2/5.0)(2 votes)
I get why it's green but the name makes it seem blue or black.
SgtSwaggr
★★☆☆☆ (2.7/5.0)(3 votes)
Insane in Innistrad.
Rikiaz
★★★★☆ (4.5/5.0)(2 votes)
This is an excellent card in my Mimeoplasm Dredge Reanimator deck. When I almost mill myself to death throw this down and return my entire graveyard to my hand, then I discard all lands, Wonder, reanimation targets, and Mimeoplasm targets back through Zombie Infestation for a shitload of Zombies, and finally Worm Harvest for tons of Worms. It usually ends with a huge mimeoplasmated monstrosity of Nantuko Husk, Fallen Angel, Marrow Chomper or any other card that can sacrifice creatures for power, powered up with Lord of Extinction for +1/+1 counters.
In a rather neat flavor interaction, Praetor's Counsel makes you immune to the negative side of Jin-Gitaxias, Core Augur. Does that mean that Vorinclex has the power to override Jin in the Phyrexian hierachy?
Enelysios
★★★★★ (5.0/5.0)(1 vote)
The reason there is no emblem here is because the effect targets you, and will only ever effect you. Emblems are used when an effect will be continuous and effect new objects as they arise, this will never need to effect additional targets, so a continuous effect works.
atemu1234
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.5/5.0)(3 votes)
I think this card is decidedly blue. I mean, if you have no maximum hand size it's drawing which is mostly blue, if you add a huge amount of cards to your hand its blue, the only thing that is green is the regrowth ability.
Dragasm
★★★☆☆ (3.0/5.0)(1 vote)
It's green because it has Vorinclex on it, and he's the green praetor. AND it gets away with being 8 cmc by being green. So no need to complain about it not being blue or black.
FatalEagle
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
T9: Omniscience, Pull from Eternity, Lightning Bolt, Praetor's Counsel, Pull from Eternity...
TheWrathofShane
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
Powerful card.
psychichobo
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
Green doesn't often do card draw. But when it does...
Aquillion
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
Whelp, they finally found a casting cost at which Yawgmoth's Will is balanced...
DaLucaray
★★★★★ (5.0/5.0)(10 votes)
I'd like to point out that this is Vorinclex, Voice of Hunger.
"Hey" "Hey Karn" "Know what sounds good right now?" ... ... "A Pizza"
Karn-"Shut UP Vorinclex!"
yesennes
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
Bane of discard decks!
blurrymadness
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
Nice with Lotus Cobra and/or blackmana ramp combos. You'll get all of your mana cards back like in Yawgwin and you can go for a lethal storm land destruction, or who knows what else.
Comments (65)
In order to make YawgWin fair, they had to more than double the cost.
However, I am very fond of the venser's journal idea. Imagine the games lasted for 40 mins already and you're now gaining 30 life per turn against a control deck, heck they might even mill themselves out before they're able to kill you if you just don't play any cards.
Must have one for every deck that can possibly support it!
I would run this over half the mythics in standard in at least two of my decks
Me and Ph'dingeer are going to Sheetz, and YOU can't come! Ahahaha."
Why they stuck this in green is beyond me, unless they were afraid of someone breaking it. I'd say if it were red (pyretic ritual? Koth? lol) or blue (Tome Scour and Hedron Crab self) it would be a lot stronger. A lot of my standard legal green decks don't fill the graveyard much at all. Potential for a blue/green deck is pretty strong.
CONCLUSION; this card was printed solely with EDH in mind. Dredge and dredge. And more dredge. and Sins of the past. and some dredge.
And what about legacy blue control decks? The ones which already often splash green to use tarmogoyf as their finisher? Having just one of these in their decks means they get all four Force of Wills back late in the game, ready to defend their goyfs from any real threat. Call me a pessimist, but this might just get hit with the banhammer, if someone takes it to its full potential.
"You get an emblem that has 'You have no maximum hand size'"
Also, is that a Hydralisk in the art?
Yes, it's like Yawgmoth's will, but without the drawback of exiling cards in your graveyard. However, there are no great ways of reliably cheating sorceries into play:
Djinn of Wishes
the slower Jhoria
Spellweaver Helix possibly with Buried Alive
Sins of the Past with Intuition/Gifts
the newly printed Galvanoth
Wrexial or Maelstrom Archangel, but what are you doing with that kind of mana in the first place anyways?
Kaho might be possible to tutor up without actually dipping into green (though you might still need lotus cobra in Gush decks). Or just hope you can flip it at random Hellcarver Demon and Mind's Desire?!.
My favorites are Hideaway lands, especially Shelldock Isle, which has great synergy with you milling yourself. It'll be tricky to stack your top cards, though.
Overall, though, the cost might just be too high
Blue and black get "return a card of a certain type from your graveyard to your hand" effects. "Return any card you want, of any type, from your graveyard to your hand" is something green gets.
Praetor's Counsel is more widely useful than Tooth 'n' Nail in my opinion; and yes, a resolved Praetor's Counsel will most likely mean that whoever casted it is about to win.
I also do believe that the potency of this spell, unlike pretty much any other sorcery that I've seen, is Vintage worthy... if you can keep your opponent from killing you on turn two and if you can keep this spell from being countered.
The necessity of graveyard hate in EDH has now increased tremendously. I will need two find a few more good colorless gy-hating cards to recommend to non-green, non-black, non-blue EDH players, because this card can be really bad news if some stupid control deck resolves this. I HIGHLY discourage running this in EDH if you are a follower of my arcane deck building practices- even before this card came out people were running Knowledge Exploitation all over the place.
For an older version, one that I love in my EDH, look at Eternal Witness.
4X Llanowar Elves
4X Joraga Treespeaker
4X Elvish archdruid
4X Traumatize
4X Hedron Crab
4X Distortion Strike
4X Psychosis Crawler
4X Preordain
2X Sphinx of Lost Truths
2XReckless Scholar
4XPraetor's Counsel
Get a psychosis crawler out, mill your self for 20 plus, drop hand of the praetor, distortion Strike for lethal. Might be fun hahaha
--
Away I go, to another Random Card.
The game rules didn't need to remember anything for this one, so it didn't need an emblem, so they didn't make it with an emblem.
Having Vorinclex in play only helps matters.
"Hey"
"Hey Karn"
"Know what sounds good right now?"
...
...
"A Pizza"
Karn-"Shut UP Vorinclex!"
voriclex:mmmmhmm yup
Karn: no way a green flyer deck?