beastly equipment that serves as a recurring creature as well. as if caw-blade needed more tools than a tutorable turn 3 4/4 recurring vigilance lifelinker.
PhyrexianFailure
★★★☆☆ (3.2/5.0)(3 votes)
I was wondering what all the fuss was about... then i remembered stoneforge mystic :)
BarryOgg
★★★☆☆ (3.5/5.0)(7 votes)
Sigh. Even with some planeswalker hate printed in NPH, next 5 months in Standard seem to look like an exercise in frustration. There's Torpor Orb, but still...
Lohran
★★☆☆☆ (2.6/5.0)(5 votes)
3rd turn with Stoneforge Mythic. And a flavorful beater that can avoid artifact and creature removal. Perfect. 5/5
healingbolt
★★★☆☆ (3.5/5.0)(3 votes)
Not going to see much play after Zendikar block rotates , but probably dominate standard thanks to Caw-Blade before that.
SwordOfKaldra
★★★☆☆ (3.5/5.0)(3 votes)
I wish I had a few Stoneforge Mystics. I've been wanting to make an equipment deck. {5} for a 4/4 vigilance lifelink is awesome, then after the token dies you can either bounce it and replay it, or use Brass Squire to equip (Kor Duelist?) for free at instant speed.
Revelation666
★★★☆☆ (3.4/5.0)(7 votes)
Stoneforge Mystic is the 2nd best card in standard right now, I think we all know what the best is, unfortunately.
MasterOfEtherium
★☆☆☆☆ (1.1/5.0)(7 votes)
Awesome equippment this thing is gonna rake. Ornithopters Memnites and that goblin that gets pimped. + the Germ it dun cum out with. DAAAAMMM. 5/5 Art is Sweet Tooooo
WateryMind
★★★★☆ (4.1/5.0)(15 votes)
This card makes me want to punch Stoneforge Mystic in the face. Seriously.
+4/+4? Ok. Vigilance? Ehhh, turns a 1/1 into a slightly beefier Serra Angel. Lifelink? Turns 1/1 into a Baneslayer. Living Weapon? Okay, what the hell?! Return to hand for 3? FFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFF!!
I predict mayhem and chaos coming from this card.
EternalLurker
★★★☆☆ (3.3/5.0)(5 votes)
This is so utterly retarded I don't know where to begin.
rinoh20
★★☆☆☆ (2.2/5.0)(2 votes)
ITS THE BATTER SKULL 5/5 no seriously. the stats are great for something in any color, you can reuse it, its nice in cawblade, it has insane equip effects when equipment usually gives something like +1/+1 for 1, and you get to scream YOU CAN'T STOP THE BATTER SKULL BABY when you play it.
majinara
★★☆☆☆ (2.1/5.0)(4 votes)
Not bad, as long as you have ways to attach it to creatures for free. Paying 10 mana would be a bit much. I think in general, I still prefer the loxodon warhammer. Trample is just too good with the power boost.
Endlessor
★★☆☆☆ (2.8/5.0)(2 votes)
Epic Card. I don't like the artwork.
sarroth
★★☆☆☆ (2.5/5.0)(3 votes)
If you hard cast it, you get a 5/5 creature with vigilance and lifelink for {5}. On top of all that you can return it to your hand for 3 to protect from Disenchant effects. That's not even considering Stoneforge Mystic. Though admittedly, the equip cost is ugly, but that's true for most of the Living Weapon cards.
Alluceanot
★★☆☆☆ (2.1/5.0)(6 votes)
I hate that this card is a mythic rare. There is nothing splashy or flavorful about it. At least Lotus Cobra was a reference to a "mythical" card from MtG's past. This has nothing. And without stoneforge it's not even great as just a powerful mythic, so it doent meet that checkmark either.
The only thing I can think of was that they wanted living weapon represented at all rarities, but they could have done a much better job than this.
Mightyass
★★★★☆ (4.6/5.0)(21 votes)
seriously, whats the flavour of this card? A vigilant battering ram that heals me and if there is no one to pick it up, it just walks around? Anyway, 4,0 seems way too low for this card - its about to become one of the best cards of New Phyrexia, in both Standard and Extended.
Amnatto
★★☆☆☆ (2.8/5.0)(2 votes)
This... is gonna kick some serious deck... I need its...
JaxsonBateman
★★☆☆☆ (2.0/5.0)(3 votes)
How this card got 4 is beyond me.
A 4/4 with vig and lifelink is about on curve. If they use a creature removal spell, you get CA. If they go straight for the artifact and you have 3 mana open, you get CA. As has been mentioned, with Stoneforge Mystic you can tutor it and put it out at a much reduced cost - pretty much making a 4/4 vig/ll on turn 3 a certainty if you draw the mystic in your opening hand.
And what hasn't been mentioned; if you're running Puresteel Paladins and for whatever reason you have 5 mana spare, you can use it to simply recycle the Batterskull (3 to return + 2 from Stoneforge Mystic) to get 1 card draw per Puresteel. Did we already mention CA?
Enemy_Tricolor
★★★☆☆ (3.3/5.0)(11 votes)
*nervously eyes WOTC*
It's...good...that you made that...awful...thing.
Dulocracy
★★★☆☆ (3.7/5.0)(5 votes)
It doesn't seem like a Mythic Rare in terms of flavor, but I'm glad they didn't make it a Rare. This is the kind of card you really, REALLY don't want to face in Limited.
roguepariah
★★★☆☆ (3.4/5.0)(4 votes)
The flavor is awkward. The existence of Stoneforge Mystic makes it an awesome card, but without being able to tutor for it and cheat it into play I think it becomes a lot less attractive.
@Donovan_Fabian Torpor Orb only negates abilities that trigger from a creature entering the battlefield. Living weapon triggers from an artifact entering the battlefield. The orb does nothing to stop a creature from being put into play from an ability like this. It does, however, stop the one card that really makes this a threat.
BuffJittePLZ
★☆☆☆☆ (1.0/5.0)(1 vote)
I am surprised at how low this is rated. 5 mana for a 4/4 vigilance, lifelink, that has a chance of continuing to effect the field even after a global creature-wipe...
scorpiolegend
★★★☆☆ (3.5/5.0)(4 votes)
WAY TOO MANY ABILITIES ON AN EQUIPMENT.
TDL
★★☆☆☆ (2.4/5.0)(8 votes)
This is a good example of a MIPO, or Mythic In Price Only.
Donovan_Fabian
★☆☆☆☆ (1.8/5.0)(2 votes)
For all of you freaking out over how to beat this thing, since most of us wont have it in our decks (you know it's bound to be $30+ by the prerelease, although some of you may go ahead and get it anyways), the surprisngly simple ways to defeat it are this..
1. Nature's claim, 1 mana removal, yes they get life.. but they were going to get batterskull lifelink life return anyways. They wont have time to bounce it or do anything else.
2. Torpor orb.. think about it, stoneforge mystic can't tutor it, and they can't grab squadron hawks to equip it. Meaning that torpor orb should prevent it from happening. This means that you can turn batterskull into plain old regular equipment with a 5 equip mana cost (pretty steep). It will still be good with puresteel paladin, but it wont be as good as a mythic. At that point it's more in line with loxodon warhammer and behemoth sledge.
3. You can also go for a more daring approach in using into the core. Remember it will exile the artifact, and you can use it the moment they try to bounce it. The only trick is into the core requires two artifacts in play. You could also use relic crush in this same way.
4. Have sacrificial or blinking blockers, aka mimic vat and argent sphinx. An aether adept on a mimic vat can bounce the germ over and over and anything else they try to equip it to.
5. Good old cunning sparkmage basilisk collar, after all it's still a creature.
If you think they are trying to hold back mana for the bounce.. or can see plainly that they are.. try doing something like play an acidic slime, target the batterskull, and then use nature's claim when they pay the mana to bounce it. Remember, it's better to deal with the equipment itself if you can, and the germ second only if you have no other way of handling it.
Overall still a deadly card, but completely beatable.
@roguepariah, ahh I see.. correcting it, but it would stop stoneforge mystic so that would pretty much fix it too as you say. After all, paying 5 for it is sort of like a weaker baneslayer more or less, and baneslayer isn't the force in standard it used to be.
TheNSNick
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
@Donovan_Fabian: Torpor Orb doesn't stop Living Weapons from creating a Germ. It only affects creatures entering the battlefield, not equipment.
Luke_BPC
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
@ph4ntom.lance - You mean the casting cost you'll never pay thanks to Stoneforge Mystic, who also makes this uncounterable? Right-o
ph4ntom.lance
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
no color commitment gain you life attack without leaving you open bounce to recur the germ token bounce to save it from artifact hate recover quickly from boardsweep equip on some other creature (anything from myr to eldrazi) new ability good even for legacy/vintage..
edit : wasn't being clear about the term starting price, as in it's worth 24$ a pop. sry, was on a tangent about the abilities of this card that there was some confusion. it is undoubtedly extremely good with stoneforge and should be worth as much now, when she rotates out however, ppl having bought this at its initial price will most likely be disappointed.. but i guess that is just marketing 101 which i won't get into since there are better threads about this for more obviously inflated cards shortly after their release
tcollins
★★☆☆☆ (2.6/5.0)(7 votes)
"Hey, lets get some more use out of that living weapon mechanic...let's make a really good card, like I'm talking mythic." "Alright, how about for {5} you get a 4/4 with vigilance and lifelink" "Yeah, that's sounds really good..but wait, what if my opponent tries to Naturalize it? I don't want that to happen! Or maybe i need that tasty 4/4 creature back...can we give it an extra ability too? How about {3} : Return ________ to it's owner's hand" "Man, that sounds reeeally powerful..you could batter alot of skulls with that" "Hey.. Batter...skull...PERFECT"
dbunting
★☆☆☆☆ (1.0/5.0)(1 vote)
I drew this at the pre-release, ended up in 2nd place out of 23 players(only lost one match, 2-0, 2-0, 1-2, 2-0, 2-0). I was able to use the 3 mana return to hand ability a couple of times to save it. The best part was seeing the peoples face when I dropped it against them during the 1st match. Love this card.
Polychromatic
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.6/5.0)(4 votes)
It irritates me when people downrate a card just because they don't like it. So stop doing it. The star system isn't a scale for how much you like the card: it's supposed to TELL PEOPLE HOW GOOD YOU THOUGHT THIS CARD WAS.
Seriously. This is 4.5, easily. It's by far the best Living Weapon, and it might even be better than the swords.
Barliman
★★★☆☆ (3.5/5.0)(2 votes)
ah ok! torpor said its creatures not permanent should have read it thoroughly first...
Cubozoan
★★★☆☆ (3.5/5.0)(4 votes)
As soon as I saw this living weapon, I fell in love. This morning, I looked again and this time noticed it was a mythic rare. Why the hell is this mythic? Mythics were supposed to be big, splashy, awesome spells/creatures with badass effects. This is a powerful, powerful card, sure, but it does not capture the mythic flavour at all. For that matter, the "return to hand" ability just feels sort of like they tacked it on to make it stronger.
Still really looking forward to pulling this, though >_>
Nighthawk42
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
This card alone makes things very tough for agro. Combined with Mystics (and with Jace in the background), agro is all but dead until the rotation.
In limited this card is simply insane. I watched a match at the pre-release where one person had a board full of creatures and enough mana to re-equip and use a heavy arbelest 3 times a turn (often 2x to repeatedly "kill" the batterskull) and he still didn't have enough time to cut through the ~100 life the batterskull player had gotten to before running out of cards.
DeathDark
★★★☆☆ (3.3/5.0)(6 votes)
The Flavor of the card, you ask?
The equipment is designed after the common siege-weapon the Battering Ram, which was used to break open gates and other large door-like structures. Hence the immense P/T boost and Vigilance (as the battering ram would never be turned sideways while striking at a door).
Further, this is a living weapon, thus it has a "flesh" part of its name, similar to SKINwing and BONEhoard. In this case, animal skulls, such as bulls, rams, or other horned animals, would generally be put on the battering ram for aesthetics.
As for the Lifelink and the Bounce... I have no idea -- it doesn't make much sense to me.
GrimjawxRULES
★★★☆☆ (3.2/5.0)(3 votes)
People who complained about Leatherback Baloth being overpowered should look away now. Used with Stoneforge Mystic, this card can hit the battlefield on your 3rd turn, and it only costs you 2 mana. That's right, gives you a 4/4 creature with lifelink and vigilance, and even if your opponent manages to kill it, you can simply return the equipment to your hand for abd replay it as a creature for again.
I do understand if people running Stoneforge Mystics are very happy about this card, but personally, this left me with a bad taste. If Phyrexian Obliterator is stupid, then this is downright degenerate.
Still 5/5 though; there's not much doubt that this card is extremely powerful. Compare it with Magma Phoenix.
HairlessThoctar
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
For the record, the Germ token piloting this thing is that little purple pimple looking thing just behind the 'head'.
BastianQoU
★★★☆☆ (3.3/5.0)(3 votes)
Just throwing this out there, the germ it would take to pilot this baby would be massive. A buddy of mine happened to pull this during the pre-release, and gave him just about every game it hit the field. Not many people were running infect, so the lifelink turned some games around. I seriously want this card.
darkgnosis
★★★★☆ (4.0/5.0)(5 votes)
Batterskull is 'equipment' in the same ways as a FV4034 Challenger 2 battle tank is equipment.
ToAsTy42o
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.5/5.0)(3 votes)
The "return to hand" ability doesn't specify where from (presumably battlefield though)... so if your opponent DOES destroy it, can you tap 3 and bring it back to your hand from the graveyard?
SloanMcgee
★★☆☆☆ (2.8/5.0)(2 votes)
5 mana for a 4/4 body with vigilance and lifelink for any color sounds great. The fact that you can equip it to other creatures and that you can bounce it just sweetens the deal even more. What happened to mythics not being overpowered Wizards?
Bursama
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
Oh dear. ... My friend got on fo there in prerelease with Karn. ... I felt I was screwed.
This card is awesome. I can't wait to use it in an upcoming deck. I placed second in an NPH booster draft last night and one of the 5 packs I won had a foil Batterskull and a Phyrexian Obliterator. I can't think of a booster pack I would have rather opened in this whole set. So pumped to play them both
TheDonMega
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
If you pull this card in limited you WILL win nuff said.
BGrock
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
Soooo I can create an Army of Germ Tokens...SWEET!
Nagoragama
★★★★☆ (4.2/5.0)(11 votes)
Yeah, I really don't get the flavor of this card at all. It's a great card, but it doesn't make sense to me. Why lifelink? Why vigilance? A living battering ram suggests trample much more to me.
Nip_Gwyllion
★☆☆☆☆ (1.5/5.0)(5 votes)
Ehh... Honestly, I don't see why this card is considered so good... Sure, it's a big creature that doesn't die to removal, but when you're dying to Tempered Steel or Infect two or three turns before you can ever get it out, it just seems... Less... Although, it does seem to have its place in a control deck... Actually, that's what people are playing it in, aren't they? Whatever. To me, a beatdown player, this card is useless. Oh, and I'll just Naturalize it the turn after you play it, Mkay? Don't wanna let you bounce it, you silly control player.
inb4 "UR STUPID & THIS CARD IS GREAT" Yeah, I know it can be good at times, it's just that, it being slow and all, it's not my style. Oh, and it's overpriced. Forgot to mention that.
Also, LOL TORPOR ORB Makes the deck that would use this card not work any more :)
Sironos
★★★☆☆ (3.7/5.0)(7 votes)
Because stone forge mystic just wasn't being played enough in standard...
endersblade
★★☆☆☆ (2.2/5.0)(3 votes)
Everyone needs to start rating this a a 5-star for a while, so we can hopefully attempt to bring the star rating back to where it is, since all the little QQ kiddies thought it would be funny to give this a low rating.
This card has won me plenty of games. It's absolutely crazy. I bought two booster boxes on release day, and got one in each :-) Was very happy. Didn't expect this thing to be worth so much, but excited that it is. Unfortunately, I sold my foily playset of Stoneforges already, so I won't be making a deck that revolves around them.
midnightvenom
★★★☆☆ (3.8/5.0)(4 votes)
@nipgwyllion Torpor Orb doesn't stop you from getting Batterskull into play for , nor does it stop you from moving it back to your hand to evade removal for . Unless they reprint Stifle in Innistrad or M12, Batterskull is going to be a beater in Type II and Extended for a while.
omgitztommy
★☆☆☆☆ (1.2/5.0)(2 votes)
@Mightyass I'm pretty sure the flavor for this card it being a Phyrexian-ized Darksteel Juggernaut. At least, that's the only thing it bears resemblence to I can think of.
Joseph_Leito
★☆☆☆☆ (1.9/5.0)(4 votes)
This is a powerhouse in constructed, and an absolute bomb in limited.
However, it's by no means unbeatable. One of the easiest ways I've found to take it out is to kill the creature it's attached to. All too often its owner will hide it back to their hand and recast it for the token to put it on (in absence of other creatures of course) and then you can just Mana leak it as soon as they do.
So in a way, it indirectly Dies to Doomblade.
alzabo
★★★☆☆ (3.9/5.0)(15 votes)
Ok, I get it. It's ridiculously good. But what is it? It just seems like a bunch of random effects thrown onto a card to make stoneforge mystic even more ridiculously good than she already is. This is exactly the sort of card that makes people hate this game.
@Nip: This thing comes out turn 3. It's a turn 3 baneslayer angel that's really difficult to remove.
RuscoJames
★★★☆☆ (3.2/5.0)(4 votes)
This is exactly what Storm Crow needs to fight off those pesky BS Angels.
TheEtheriumMaster
★★★☆☆ (3.9/5.0)(9 votes)
Oh god! Even if I do kill the germ token they'll just return it and recast it!! Was that necessary to add R&D????
mlanier131
★★★★☆ (4.5/5.0)(20 votes)
Not sure why every color should have lifelink, not sure why a battering ram gives lifelink. Its a powerful card and I enjoy using it to kill aggro strategies, in just not sure what or why it is doing what it is doing.
made4ipod
★★★☆☆ (3.1/5.0)(7 votes)
Dear WotC, ARE YOU F**KING CRAZY???!!! FIRST JACE AND STONEFORGE, THEN THE OTHER POWERFUL EQUIPMENTS, NOW THIS??!! WTF?!
Sincerely, The Players
mauro6006
★★★☆☆ (3.5/5.0)(3 votes)
The little germ is crying because its BFF was banned.
TrueBloodWolf
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.5/5.0)(1 vote)
okay, I can't tell is this Phrexian or Mirrodin flavor?
MrBarrelRoll
★★★★☆ (4.4/5.0)(25 votes)
I really don't get the flavor behind this. It shows something like a battering ram charging at some dudes, tossing them into the air. So what abilities does it grant, trample and haste? Wait, vigilance? What part of a battering ram is vigilant? After it knocks down the front door of their castle, it runs back to defend you during the counterattack? Whaaaat? And I'm not even going to try and decipher the lifelink.
This card is a flavor trainwreck.
TheSwarm
★★★★☆ (4.0/5.0)(2 votes)
This card is an incredibly versatile.. I don't even know what to call it, THING. It isn't really a bomb but can win you games, it isn't really a wall but plays insane defense, and isn't really a midrange Creature but puts great pressure on the opponent, all at the same time. It attacks, blocks, begins stabilizing your life total and board position turn five which is insane, as it comes down directly post-DOJ, and can be recast again and again or re-equipped to something bigger. It provides a wide range of versatile and useful purposes, and is overall a ridiculous card that is hard to overcome sometimes. It isn't the pre-banning "Two Mana Tutorable, cheatable, unkillable Baneslayer Angel" that it used to be, but it is still very good and I hope will see a lot of play.
rawsugar
★☆☆☆☆ (1.0/5.0)(1 vote)
ppl...its magic...its steals lifewith magic, it walks by magic...the form is really not important. Since it seems to be huge and can be used as a weapon by a faerie it oviously must have sizealtering and quite likely form altering magic as well as animation and lifesteal. simple. whenever you have trouble understanding how a card works in the real world just remember...its magic...
and its great. good that its 5 mana making it tricky to find a spot without a little ramp/stall. had it been 4 and fx 3/4 or 3/3 it would show up much too often^^
Disruptor
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
Ok, 4,5 stars minus 4 for the art... just joking, it's an incredible non-doom bladeable card (since it's a living weapon) and lives enough to make a pseudo BS out of a llanowar elves (yes, since mrs stoneforge got banned, this card is nice in green). Why green? 1st, it's a good easy to play pseudo-black monster in a green deck. 2nd, even without doom blade, if it's removed, it's also easy to equip. 3rd, if your opponent face this card before i don't know a green Terra Stomper beatdown card, he wil be doubtfull if sidedecking cards like Shatter.
JFM2796
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
This is one of the most pathetic excuses for a mythic rare I have ever seen. Not saying it isn't good though, in fact it is very good. But there is nothing about this that feels mythic at all. Its a freakin' battering ram! Do the people of New Phyrexia bow down to a battering ram? Maybe vigilance is understandable but lifelink? Its a battering ram that absorbs the life from its victims? Seems like the only reason its mythic is to make it harder to find in a booster.
Faralay
★★★☆☆ (3.2/5.0)(5 votes)
As of July 1, 2011, Jace, the Mind Sculptor and the reason why Batterskull was so good, Stoneforge Mystic, will be banned in Standard. Those who see this card in a later day and age will think "Wow, look at how good this card is! For only five mana?!" And then they'll see all of the links to the Mystic. Two mana, 4/4 vigilant lifelinkers ruled the land for a short time.
Will this card ever see Standard play without its tutoring, cost-reducing friend tossing it out for three mana cheaper? Doubtful, but we'll see what the new Standard brings in four months.
EDIT: It's been a month since our friends were banned, and Caw-Blade STILL dominates the format, even without this bounce-able fatty and its banned BBFs (BBBFs?). I'm really disappointed in WotC about the Standard state.
Anyway, I didn't talk so much about the card itself when I first wrote this comment, so I will now. Aaron Forsythe, the Random Card Comment of the Day writer, said himself that Batterskull "had a late development change that made it better" that he somewhat regrets. While he may never say what that change actually was, most decent Magic players assume that it is Batterskull's ability to bounce himself. Any creature that can return itself to your hand is pretty good; a colorless, vigilant, lifelinking 4/4 that can do it is ridiculous. Creature removal is way more prevalent than any other type of removal, and Batterskull enjoys this very much. Go ahead, Dismember my Germ token. If you're not running counterspells or artifact removal, this card will ruin your day.
As for an actual star rating, I'm very torn. In a Standard environment filled with Dismembers and Titans, this card just fails to stand out. It breaks my heart to see this excellent card fall by the wayside as another victim of power creep. So what used to be a 5/5 card in the days of old now stands as a 4/5.
PwNaGe712
★★☆☆☆ (2.3/5.0)(3 votes)
Btw guys, it is a BLACK germ token, so you cant freaking Doomblade it anything. Jesus Christ
DarthParallax
★★★☆☆ (3.5/5.0)(12 votes)
Gatherer, I'm ashamed of you. Somebody else should have said this by now:
one of these days i'll make a living weapon deck. and with a few of these cards... FEAR MY GERMS! good metagame against germophobes
Asmodi0000
★★★☆☆ (3.8/5.0)(15 votes)
I hate this card. I hate it for precisely the same reason I hate Baneslayer Angel.
A 4/4 for ? Okay, we have a stone golem. Solid, but only for limited. It's a living weapon? That makes it a fair amount more powerful and versatile, even though it's equip cost is . +4/+4 to a creature for is pretty good, and can win games.
If we stop there, we have a moderately well costed card. Since it's stronger than most uncommons, it would be about a weak rare. But, I will agree that it's a little boring. So why not add a keyword? Vigilance? Alright. A vigilant 4/4 for isn't game breaking, and equipping it to a creature can make for a tricky situation, but I'm not hating this card. This would be a solid rare.
Returning to the hand for ? I understand. This is the powerful ability to push it to mythic. A living weapon that can be recast, or bounced to protect itself? That's pretty crazy, and it's already a lot stronger than most cards in the game, but I understand you want to sell booster packs. Go ahead, print the card.
Wait. What?
No. No no no. Do not add lifelink. Remember that 5/5 first strike flyer for mana? Yeah, adding some seldom-used protections for flavor is okay. It's already better than a lot of angels, so why not leave it at that? Why do you have to add lifelink, and shred any sense of balance that the card might have had?
Now that I think of it, Wurmcoil has the same problem. If it was a 6/6 deathtouch for that split into two 3/3's with deathtouch, it would have been a powerful card. Much more powerful than any of it's predecessors. I know you wanted to distinguish it from grave titan, but why add lifelink?
It's not that I hate lifelink. It's a powerful and interesting ability that makes lifegain actually matter. But when you slap it on an already powerful creature, it turns it into an untidy, nasty beast that doesn't make the game fun.
Salient
★★★☆☆ (3.7/5.0)(6 votes)
Thanks for gunking up Legacy for the summer of 2011.
It won't surprise me when Stoneforge Mystic receives a Legacy banhammer. There are Top 16 Legacy tournament placements now consisting almost entirely of (a) "Stoneblade" Stoneforge Mystic + Batterskull + Sword of X and Y combos and (b) Natural Order race decks that are hyper-specifically designed to pound Stoneblade with Progenitus.
...why does a battering ram of all things give you vigilance?
Oh right, it's an overly strong colourless mythic. This is why I don't like scars block much.
Dr.Pingas
★★★☆☆ (3.4/5.0)(5 votes)
I really actually enjoy the fact that it returns itself to your hand. I think all Living Weapons should do that. I also think they should have been BETTER. They were all just trainwrecks of poor design, and many of them were just not good at all in any capacity, besides the few lucky ones. Most of them were just crappy creatures that dropped off into crappy equipment that I would never ever consider using - which is a shame, because since Alara I was saying "they should make equipment that can equip to itself somehow; maybe "if this card would become a creature, put a 0/0 token into play and attach this card to it instead". But this is how my idea was played out? Well magic, at least I know your psychic spies listen, and you tried.
Really, I ALMOST got this, until it didn't have trample. It could have just been a Loxodon Warhammer/Behemoth Sledge for your face, but no, instead for some reason, the fact that it's a battering ram means you'd rather be on-guard than plowing through them. Yeah, I don't get it either. If I pulled this, I'd ragequit. Maybe if it were legendary and had something cooler than half a baneslayer and a germ-token refresh button, but there is nothing interesting or cool about this card.
I will say though, it is one of the few Living Weapons that actually seemed cost-effective. I would actually pay for +4/+4, vigilance(which is hard to find on equipment, I think a grand totally of 3 give it?), and Lifelink, the most powerful lifegain there is. But I feel bad for the guy trying to siege a castle's gates with this just to find out he can't break through anything - just to have his weapon suddenly vanish from his hands and re-appear next to him with a weird bug in it.
bfellow
★★★★☆ (4.1/5.0)(5 votes)
Hey its Wurmcoil light except the germ dodges Doom Blade! Still seeing alot of standard play even without cheating it in was the fun thing to do.
alextfish
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
In all the raving about this card, don't forget the most important factor:
@mlanier131 I think loxodon warhammer has the same issue with the lifelink
A3Kitsune
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
I wonder if the decision to have this grant vigilance instead of trample was because of infect being in the block.
EvincarCrovax
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
Haste and trample would have made more sense based on the art and name.
eisbrecher03
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
Makes Germ tribal possible? Or you could just toss it onto Grimgrin, I suppose...
Vincelli
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.5/5.0)(1 vote)
Am I misunderstanding this card or can your opponent simply pay 3 and return Batterskull to your hand at any time?? There simply is no time to use it without haste..
PanzerDragoon
★★★☆☆ (3.9/5.0)(4 votes)
You could, quite frankly, put this card in any deck. Extremely versatile and self-serving at the same time. On top of that it can protect itself. 5/5.
@Vincelli, Unless a card specifically says so, only the owner of a permanent can activate its abilities. Your opponents will wish they could return it to your hand. And then you will batter them.
shotoku64
★★★★☆ (4.2/5.0)(5 votes)
I think this is the phyrexian equivalent of Magitek Armor from Final Fantasy 6. It's just that brutal. Between this and Wurmcoil Engine, it's no wonder Mirrodin lost the war.
j_mindfingerpainter
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
And in light of new evidence, Venser decided he could work for the Phyrexians part-time.
LordofLiege
★★☆☆☆ (2.0/5.0)(3 votes)
Does the flavor make sense? heck no. do i care? for a 4/4, lifelink, vigilance, removal dodging, creature i can equip to other creatures I would tell you that the sky is purple and America is still a colony.
MoonBeam444
★★★☆☆ (3.5/5.0)(3 votes)
@DarthParallax; @Arachibutyrophobia
Grond?
What are you two tolkien' about? O_o
KokoshoForPresident
★★☆☆☆ (2.8/5.0)(2 votes)
I agree with LordofLiege. We have had like 50 people say that this card doesn't have the right flavor, or flavor that makes sense. We don't need everybody else to say the same thing. I personally think this could be very evil on a palace guard. Or with a puresteel paladin.
Batterskull is a very neat card. Mythic equipments are always really good. Maybe not heavy on the flavor but defiantly something cool/broken to collect and play.
immelmann
★★★☆☆ (3.5/5.0)(9 votes)
A mythic, whist being powerful, should be flavourful and well designed as well. A mythic should have the "woah" factor. Think Progenitus or Lorthos, the Tidemaker. Extremely flavourful without being flat out broken.
Batterskull is just a stupid (yes, stupid) vigilant bouncing battering ram that gains life which is also an wearable equipment. HUH. how is a battering ram so nimble it can return to your hand at a whim? how does it gain you health exactly? how....I give up. This card looks like someone in R&D just vomited out a whole bunch of keywords on a random artifact.
Also, Stoneforge Mystic was still in standard when this card was printed. Seriously, did Wizards not realise what they had done? For a while FNMs was so blatantly pay2win, you have all these people running around with $500 decks (!) with their Jaces and flying birds that held swords and wearable healing battering rams. It was ridiculous.
yousquiddinme
★★★☆☆ (3.5/5.0)(3 votes)
Ya'll can boohoo about the flavor all day, it's still a brilliant card.
1. Batterskull, pass 2. Win
Rikiaz
★★★☆☆ (3.5/5.0)(3 votes)
Everyone saying Torpor Orb counters living weapon do you even read the cards? Torpor Orb specifically says "Creatures entering the battlefield don't cause abilities to trigger." Living Weapon Equipment cards are not creatures, please learn to read. /rant
Now on topic, this card is insanely powerful, probably one of the most powerful and balenced cards in standard. Open one in Limited and you will win nine times out of ten.
Lordocean
★★★☆☆ (3.7/5.0)(3 votes)
So many comments about how this card makes no flavour sense. You're not trying hard enough. So, for starters, I like to imagine the Germ creatures that hold living weapons are like gormless balls of flesh built into the equipment. When they die, they burst and rot leaving space for something else to climb in and activate the exoskeleton. The batter skull I imagine would be ridden from its brain cavity, making the creature equipped with it look a bit like Sheoldred (who is apparently able to detach from her body BTW). Ok, now look at its long body with all those legs. Someone else commented 'what, is it knocking their door down and running back to defend again?' Well maybe it is. You can't see it all on the card. It must be enormous, easily the largest Equipment in the game. I bet it can twist around like a centipede and defend as well as attack. Now, the lifelink. Hmm. Well, being phyrexian, maybe when it smashes things it absorbs and consumes their bodies to make energy. Oh I don't know how do you normally explain lifelink anyway? Well it may just be a bunch of keywords anyway but for me the fun of the game was imagining WHY a card did what it did, and I've explained them all... Until now!
DacenOctavio
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
Jitterskull. I just played in a customized Split Card cube where actual cards were spliced together to make split cards. This one in particular was polymerized into Batterskull//Emerge Unscathed. It was possible to bounce Batterskull, cast Emerge Unscathed to save a creature, and use the rebound ability to play Batterskull for free. There's a very, very good reason Wizards has never put permanents on split cards.
BloodCrank
★★☆☆☆ (2.8/5.0)(2 votes)
You can't make sense of em all. Sometimes R&D just wants to make a broken as hell card.
ParallaxtheRevan
★★☆☆☆ (2.2/5.0)(8 votes)
This card has Lifelink for one reason:
MEAT. The Phyrexians process life into unlife and use it exactly like Green cards have often used Feasting and Meatiness to gain life.
Why would a Giant War Machine gain life for you? Why would it be able to block well?
Because it is HUGE. made of MEAT. ZOMBIE MEAT. Have you ever tried to attack a wall of zombie meat?
How about a Tree-Trunk sized wall of Zombie Meat being hurled repeatedly into your face? It is because MASSIVE ENOUGH SIEGE WEAPONS are like Walls themselves when you try to destroy them.
They are relentless, they aren't indestructible, but they have HUGE Defense and HP points. It takes many many whacks with a sword to try to destroy Batterskull. Even setting it on Fire is going to take some effort, no ordinary 3 damage spells can take it out, you need to burn it for 5 at least!
It has Vigilance not because it's a protector of your own lifetotal, so much as it a GIANT, SLAG, OF MEAT, and that means it is very tough, very resilient. AND IT LEAVES A SENSE OF RELENTLESS INEVITABLE DOOM IN A CLOUD AROUND IT AS IT TRAMPS TO YOUR GATES! The feel of having your doors battered and rammed against? Having a Batterskull on the wrong side of the table puts you in the position of getting to know what the Soldiers of Gondor or Peasant Garrisson of Helm's Deep felt like!
if it had Haste, the Return to Hand clause would make more sense: Because you'd be viscerally, THROWING it in your opponent's face, every, turn. :O
I never like those decks that lack a coherent flavour, that just feel like a random assortment of over-powered stuff. I know a lot of people criticize tribal decks as unimaginative and building by numbers, but at least they feel like a story. This card is pretty much a microcosm of all those good stuff decks that crush my crappy soldiers or elves. Too powerful, too much of a flavour mishmash, and played by people who take the game seriously and aim to win. Not their fault, but mine for missing the point.
DoragonShinzui
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
I can't understand this card. I mean, vigilance and lifelink. For what reason? Every other Living Weapon had some rhyme or reason to its abilities, and this just looks like someone on the R&D team had a dartboard and a favor to call in.
Really, Trample is all this card needed. Trample and perhaps the restoration function. Bump the rarity down to Rare, reduce it's absurd and stupid powers, and then we'll talk Wizards. Until then, stop making random ass overpowered artifacts. *coughWurmcoilcough*
In addition, the art is just damned terrible, what the ***, guys? What even is that?
Zetan
★★★★☆ (4.3/5.0)(10 votes)
When your opponent drops this, use the phasing part of Sapphire Charm on the Germ token.
702.24k Phased-out tokens cease to exist as a state-based action.
702.24f When a permanent phases out, any Auras, Equipment, or Fortifications attached to that permanent phase out at the same time. This alternate way of phasing out is known as phasing out "indirectly." An Aura, Equipment, or Fortification that phased out indirectly won't phase in by itself, but instead phases in along with the permanent it's attached to.
702.24b If a permanent phases out, its status changes to "phased out." Except for rules and effects that specifically mention phased-out permanents, a phased-out permanent is treated as though it does not exist. It can't affect or be affected by anything else in the game.
That's right, I didn't just exile your Batterskull... I caused it to no longer exist. For a single blue mana, at instant speed.
EGarrett01
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
AKA "Red Deck Loses."
MattLynn
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
Wish it trampled. Trample fits the flavor slightly more than lifelink...though its nice in game.
SAUS3
★★★☆☆ (3.9/5.0)(4 votes)
@Dragonshoredreamz Even though your explanations are good, the card could have been changed so that it would be explained more easily. Just because you can explain something doesn't mean it's good design. This card makes no sense. It really is just a bunch of OP keywords tacked onto one card because it's a mythic rare.
As for the card, terrible design. Nothing interesting about it, and the flavour is all off.
Kaleidostorm
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
Equipped creature becomes Wurmcoil Engine.
Dragonshoredreamz
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.8/5.0)(2 votes)
@MRK1
Spoken like a TRUE Magic player.
troll_berserker
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
I hate the art and flavor of this. As everybody else had noted, the flavor of the card makes no sense whatsoever, and the art is an eyesore to look at, even if it had matched the flavor (wtf is on it's back?). The worst part is that it's so powerful that I have to run it in my Stoneforge Mystic deck to be competitive.
I wish this card gets reprinted one day with new art that corrects the flavor. It could be some kind of Bat/Vampire themed battering ram for example.
rike889
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
*Should Be higher on the scale of 5 drop artifacts in modern*
Lifegainwithbite
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
Regardless of how strange Batterskull's abilities may seem, it's a really fun card to play with and it introduced a new, strange and fun mechanic to the game. I suppose it didn't need to have strange abilities like vigilance and lifelink but I'm still glad it introduced the living weapon mechanic.
Also I see nothing wrong with the art. It's meant to be ugly and scary-looking and it does that well.
MechaKraken
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
Grimgrin, Corpse-born loves this guy. With it equipped to himself, Grimgrin can avoid having to eat his own men in order to untap =)
I don't get all the people saying it has no flavor.
Vigilance probably is implied by the fact that the thing is so huge that even after its attacked it's a bulky defender they're going to have to fight their way through.
As for lifelink, well... if you look at the promo art, it becomes obvious the front of the thing is a mouth. It's eating them.
I do find the self bounce ability bizarre and somewhat unnecessary, though.
Paleopaladin
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
EDIT -- @NARFNra wrote "Vigilance probably is implied by the fact that the thing is so huge that even after its attacked it's a bulky defender they're going to have to fight their way through."
Did you really just write that? Being "bulky" means that you're a deft and vigilant defender? People fight "through" battering rams? As a thought exercise, I invite you to consider which side of a seige makes use of battering rams: the attackers or the defenders?
The art that shows "eating" might explain lifelink (although one wonders what sort of lifeforce a battering ram is consuming from eating a castle wall...). OK, I'll sorta, kinda give you that. That still doesn't explain the bouncey-ness.
---------------
Anyone seeing a trend and wonder if Wizards is trolling us with BS cards it knows are broken? BaneSlayer Angel, BlightSteel Colossus, and BatterSkull? Obvious 5/5 uber-play that oozes card advantage...but...
This is just about as badly-designed of a card as I've ever seen. It's transparently broken and none of its abilities make sense from a flavor standpoint.
Vigilance makes ZERO sense for a battering ram. Serra Angels, Elite Inquisitors, Steadfast Guards and such presumably have fast reflexes and take deft swings and thrusts that they recover quickly from to reset their defenses. Why does a battering ram confer this upon the beings wielding it?
The bouncy-ness makes power/card advantage sense (eg, to screw Oblivion Ring--a card I definitely DON'T mind screwing!!!), but is bewildering from a flavor/form standpoint. What's the reasoning? Why does a battering ram so easily escape people who want to smash it or cast a spell on it? If it were so STRONG that it resisted such things, that would be fine, but it metaphorically "dodging" is weird.
I hand-waive lifelink since in fantasy "life-draining weapons" are classic fixtures, but even so, battering rams usually aren't aimed at living things--so why would they be imbued with life-draining magics? Of course, every other thing about this is an even more serious "WTF?"
Compare this card to, say, Boggart Ram-Gang which is also a battering ram and an incredibly strong play, but in-flavor and not broken. If I could retcon Batterskull, I'd lose the vigilance in favor of trample. Obviously we wouldn't want wither for a block that's introduced infect, so maybe haste or deathtouch or something? Then I'd swap the bouncey-ness for shroud (of it, and maybe of the equipped creature too) and balance it out by making the equipped creature unable to block (which makes sense since battering rams aren't defensive).
I like it when I read a card's name, mechanics, see its picture, and the backstory and theory of it just comes out intuitively (regardless of falvor text). That's definitely not the case with this card. Cards like this have the same effect on me that I'd get if I were reading a great novel and then suddenly on page 143, the author decided to break the fourth wall. This thing is the black sheep of the BS family--far more deserving of hate than even Baneslayer and Blightsteel.
cmvedder2
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
one of my favorite cards. works very well with etched champion and darksteel juggernaut in my experience
blurrymadness
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
Oh my, I think I cracked the flavor of this card! -Vigilance: If you're battering down someones gates you're besieging them. There's no way around the obstacle pounding your gates because you're cornered; so you have to fight through it. -Lifelink: If you're besieging a settlement then you're starving them out; maybe you're raiding the caravans that would bring food to the city or the reverse life-gain is a less-broken way of representing the health of the defenders vs. the attackers (as otherwise it could just sit there and rob you of your life-total without attacking/besieging!)
MrPendent
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
About the flavor:
First, note that the germ is sitting on top, sort of piloting it. If you look along the body, you can see a bunch of legs, but not any real segments. It's got vigilance because it changes forward and then moves backwards to charge again. It doesn't turn.
Someone mentioned that "if no one is there to pick it up, it just gets up and walks around on it's own." Actually, with pretty much every living weapon, if you look at the art closely you can see the germ token sitting in the equipment, piloting it. (in Batterskull he is sitting on the top, right after the plate on top of the "head").
The lifelink comes, perhaps, from the many needles and spikes along the front of Batterskull--draining blood and giving life to the pilot.
That's my opinion, anyway.
Tyrrune
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
Looking at the art and abilities, I think i know what it's supposed to be, flavor wise. To me, it looks like the phyrexians took a Plated Slagwurm, compleated it, and modified it to accept a pilot. When installed, the merged intelligence and digestive track grant a sense of strategy and the capacity to feed on prey. What's more, the modifications are so extensive that, if the "second brain" is killed, and no other creature is around to jump in, it can retreat and regrow it's second brain, and get back in the fight.
That had to be what they (the design team) were thinking. Beyond that, i got nothing.
Comments (121)
And a flavorful beater that can avoid artifact and creature removal.
Perfect.
5/5
+4/+4? Ok.
Vigilance? Ehhh, turns a 1/1 into a slightly beefier Serra Angel.
Lifelink? Turns 1/1 into a Baneslayer.
Living Weapon? Okay, what the hell?!
Return to hand for 3? FFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFF!!
I predict mayhem and chaos coming from this card.
The only thing I can think of was that they wanted living weapon represented at all rarities, but they could have done a much better job than this.
Anyway, 4,0 seems way too low for this card - its about to become one of the best cards of New Phyrexia, in both Standard and Extended.
A 4/4 with vig and lifelink is about on curve. If they use a creature removal spell, you get CA. If they go straight for the artifact and you have 3 mana open, you get CA. As has been mentioned, with Stoneforge Mystic you can tutor it and put it out at a much reduced cost - pretty much making a 4/4 vig/ll on turn 3 a certainty if you draw the mystic in your opening hand.
And what hasn't been mentioned; if you're running Puresteel Paladins and for whatever reason you have 5 mana spare, you can use it to simply recycle the Batterskull (3 to return + 2 from Stoneforge Mystic) to get 1 card draw per Puresteel. Did we already mention CA?
It's...good...that you made that...awful...thing.
@Donovan_Fabian
Torpor Orb only negates abilities that trigger from a creature entering the battlefield. Living weapon triggers from an artifact entering the battlefield. The orb does nothing to stop a creature from being put into play from an ability like this. It does, however, stop the one card that really makes this a threat.
1. Nature's claim, 1 mana removal, yes they get life.. but they were going to get batterskull lifelink life return anyways. They wont have time to bounce it or do anything else.
2. Torpor orb.. think about it, stoneforge mystic can't tutor it, and they can't grab squadron hawks to equip it. Meaning that torpor orb should prevent it from happening. This means that you can turn batterskull into plain old regular equipment with a 5 equip mana cost (pretty steep). It will still be good with puresteel paladin, but it wont be as good as a mythic. At that point it's more in line with loxodon warhammer and behemoth sledge.
3. You can also go for a more daring approach in using into the core. Remember it will exile the artifact, and you can use it the moment they try to bounce it. The only trick is into the core requires two artifacts in play. You could also use relic crush in this same way.
4. Have sacrificial or blinking blockers, aka mimic vat and argent sphinx. An aether adept on a mimic vat can bounce the germ over and over and anything else they try to equip it to.
5. Good old cunning sparkmage basilisk collar, after all it's still a creature.
If you think they are trying to hold back mana for the bounce.. or can see plainly that they are.. try doing something like play an acidic slime, target the batterskull, and then use nature's claim when they pay the mana to bounce it. Remember, it's better to deal with the equipment itself if you can, and the germ second only if you have no other way of handling it.
Overall still a deadly card, but completely beatable.
@roguepariah, ahh I see.. correcting it, but it would stop stoneforge mystic so that would pretty much fix it too as you say. After all, paying 5 for it is sort of like a weaker baneslayer more or less, and baneslayer isn't the force in standard it used to be.
gain you life
attack without leaving you open
bounce to recur the germ token
bounce to save it from artifact hate
recover quickly from boardsweep
equip on some other creature (anything from myr to eldrazi)
new ability good even for legacy/vintage..
edit : wasn't being clear about the term starting price, as in it's worth 24$ a pop. sry, was on a tangent about the abilities of this card that there was some confusion. it is undoubtedly extremely good with stoneforge and should be worth as much now, when she rotates out however, ppl having bought this at its initial price will most likely be disappointed.. but i guess that is just marketing 101 which i won't get into since there are better threads about this for more obviously inflated cards shortly after their release
"Alright, how about for {5} you get a 4/4 with vigilance and lifelink"
"Yeah, that's sounds really good..but wait, what if my opponent tries to Naturalize it? I don't want that to happen! Or maybe i need that tasty 4/4 creature back...can we give it an extra ability too? How about {3} : Return ________ to it's owner's hand"
"Man, that sounds reeeally powerful..you could batter alot of skulls with that"
"Hey.. Batter...skull...PERFECT"
Seriously. This is 4.5, easily. It's by far the best Living Weapon, and it might even be better than the swords.
This morning, I looked again and this time noticed it was a mythic rare.
Why the hell is this mythic? Mythics were supposed to be big, splashy, awesome spells/creatures with badass effects. This is a powerful, powerful card, sure, but it does not capture the mythic flavour at all. For that matter, the "return to hand" ability just feels sort of like they tacked it on to make it stronger.
Still really looking forward to pulling this, though >_>
In limited this card is simply insane. I watched a match at the pre-release where one person had a board full of creatures and enough mana to re-equip and use a heavy arbelest 3 times a turn (often 2x to repeatedly "kill" the batterskull) and he still didn't have enough time to cut through the ~100 life the batterskull player had gotten to before running out of cards.
The equipment is designed after the common siege-weapon the Battering Ram, which was used to break open gates and other large door-like structures. Hence the immense P/T boost and Vigilance (as the battering ram would never be turned sideways while striking at a door).
Further, this is a living weapon, thus it has a "flesh" part of its name, similar to SKINwing and BONEhoard. In this case, animal skulls, such as bulls, rams, or other horned animals, would generally be put on the battering ram for aesthetics.
As for the Lifelink and the Bounce... I have no idea -- it doesn't make much sense to me.
I do understand if people running Stoneforge Mystics are very happy about this card, but personally, this left me with a bad taste. If Phyrexian Obliterator is stupid, then this is downright degenerate.
Still 5/5 though; there's not much doubt that this card is extremely powerful.
Compare it with Magma Phoenix.
A buddy of mine happened to pull this during the pre-release, and gave him just about every game it hit the field. Not many people were running infect, so the lifelink turned some games around. I seriously want this card.
... My friend got on fo there in prerelease with Karn.
... I felt I was screwed.
Although, it does seem to have its place in a control deck... Actually, that's what people are playing it in, aren't they? Whatever. To me, a beatdown player, this card is useless. Oh, and I'll just Naturalize it the turn after you play it, Mkay? Don't wanna let you bounce it, you silly control player.
inb4 "UR STUPID & THIS CARD IS GREAT"
Yeah, I know it can be good at times, it's just that, it being slow and all, it's not my style. Oh, and it's overpriced. Forgot to mention that.
Also, LOL TORPOR ORB
Makes the deck that would use this card not work any more :)
This card has won me plenty of games. It's absolutely crazy. I bought two booster boxes on release day, and got one in each :-) Was very happy. Didn't expect this thing to be worth so much, but excited that it is. Unfortunately, I sold my foily playset of Stoneforges already, so I won't be making a deck that revolves around them.
I'm pretty sure the flavor for this card it being a Phyrexian-ized Darksteel Juggernaut. At least, that's the only thing it bears resemblence to I can think of.
However, it's by no means unbeatable. One of the easiest ways I've found to take it out is to kill the creature it's attached to. All too often its owner will hide it back to their hand and recast it for the token to put it on (in absence of other creatures of course) and then you can just Mana leak it as soon as they do.
So in a way, it indirectly Dies to Doomblade.
@Nip: This thing comes out turn 3. It's a turn 3 baneslayer angel that's really difficult to remove.
ARE YOU F**KING CRAZY???!!! FIRST JACE AND STONEFORGE, THEN THE OTHER POWERFUL EQUIPMENTS, NOW THIS??!! WTF?!
Sincerely,
The Players
is this Phrexian or Mirrodin flavor?
This card is a flavor trainwreck.
and its great. good that its 5 mana making it tricky to find a spot without a little ramp/stall. had it been 4 and fx 3/4 or 3/3 it would show up much too often^^
Not saying it isn't good though, in fact it is very good. But there is nothing about this that feels mythic at all. Its a freakin' battering ram! Do the people of New Phyrexia bow down to a battering ram? Maybe vigilance is understandable but lifelink? Its a battering ram that absorbs the life from its victims? Seems like the only reason its mythic is to make it harder to find in a booster.
Will this card ever see Standard play without its tutoring, cost-reducing friend tossing it out for three mana cheaper? Doubtful, but we'll see what the new Standard brings in four months.
EDIT: It's been a month since our friends were banned, and Caw-Blade STILL dominates the format, even without this bounce-able fatty and its banned BBFs (BBBFs?). I'm really disappointed in WotC about the Standard state.
Anyway, I didn't talk so much about the card itself when I first wrote this comment, so I will now. Aaron Forsythe, the Random Card Comment of the Day writer, said himself that Batterskull "had a late development change that made it better" that he somewhat regrets. While he may never say what that change actually was, most decent Magic players assume that it is Batterskull's ability to bounce himself. Any creature that can return itself to your hand is pretty good; a colorless, vigilant, lifelinking 4/4 that can do it is ridiculous. Creature removal is way more prevalent than any other type of removal, and Batterskull enjoys this very much. Go ahead, Dismember my Germ token. If you're not running counterspells or artifact removal, this card will ruin your day.
As for an actual star rating, I'm very torn. In a Standard environment filled with Dismembers and Titans, this card just fails to stand out. It breaks my heart to see this excellent card fall by the wayside as another victim of power creep. So what used to be a 5/5 card in the days of old now stands as a 4/5.
GROND! GROND! GROND! GROND! GROND! GROND! GROND! GROND! GROND! GROND!
FEAR MY GERMS!
good metagame against germophobes
A 4/4 for
It's a living weapon? That makes it a fair amount more powerful and versatile, even though it's equip cost is
If we stop there, we have a moderately well costed card. Since it's stronger than most uncommons, it would be about a weak rare. But, I will agree that it's a little boring. So why not add a keyword?
Vigilance? Alright. A vigilant 4/4 for
Returning to the hand for
Wait. What?
No. No no no. Do not add lifelink. Remember that 5/5 first strike flyer for
Now that I think of it, Wurmcoil has the same problem. If it was a 6/6 deathtouch for
It's not that I hate lifelink. It's a powerful and interesting ability that makes lifegain actually matter. But when you slap it on an already powerful creature, it turns it into an untidy, nasty beast that doesn't make the game fun.
It won't surprise me when Stoneforge Mystic receives a Legacy banhammer. There are Top 16 Legacy tournament placements now consisting almost entirely of (a) "Stoneblade" Stoneforge Mystic + Batterskull + Sword of X and Y combos and (b) Natural Order race decks that are hyper-specifically designed to pound Stoneblade with Progenitus.
Oh right, it's an overly strong colourless mythic. This is why I don't like scars block much.
Really, I ALMOST got this, until it didn't have trample. It could have just been a Loxodon Warhammer/Behemoth Sledge for your face, but no, instead for some reason, the fact that it's a battering ram means you'd rather be on-guard than plowing through them.
Yeah, I don't get it either. If I pulled this, I'd ragequit. Maybe if it were legendary and had something cooler than half a baneslayer and a germ-token refresh button, but there is nothing interesting or cool about this card.
I will say though, it is one of the few Living Weapons that actually seemed cost-effective. I would actually pay
But I feel bad for the guy trying to siege a castle's gates with this just to find out he can't break through anything - just to have his weapon suddenly vanish from his hands and re-appear next to him with a weird bug in it.
It's strictly better than Sliptide Serpent!
I think loxodon warhammer has the same issue with the lifelink
@Vincelli, Unless a card specifically says so, only the owner of a permanent can activate its abilities. Your opponents will wish they could return it to your hand. And then you will batter them.
Grond?
What are you two tolkien' about? O_o
Batterskull is just a stupid (yes, stupid) vigilant bouncing battering ram that gains life which is also an wearable equipment. HUH. how is a battering ram so nimble it can return to your hand at a whim? how does it gain you health exactly? how....I give up. This card looks like someone in R&D just vomited out a whole bunch of keywords on a random artifact.
Also, Stoneforge Mystic was still in standard when this card was printed. Seriously, did Wizards not realise what they had done? For a while FNMs was so blatantly pay2win, you have all these people running around with $500 decks (!) with their Jaces and flying birds that held swords and wearable healing battering rams. It was ridiculous.
1. Batterskull, pass
2. Win
Torpor Orb specifically says "Creatures entering the battlefield don't cause abilities to trigger." Living Weapon Equipment cards are not creatures, please learn to read.
/rant
Now on topic, this card is insanely powerful, probably one of the most powerful and balenced cards in standard. Open one in Limited and you will win nine times out of ten.
Well it may just be a bunch of keywords anyway but for me the fun of the game was imagining WHY a card did what it did, and I've explained them all... Until now!
MEAT. The Phyrexians process life into unlife and use it exactly like Green cards have often used Feasting and Meatiness to gain life.
Why would a Giant War Machine gain life for you? Why would it be able to block well?
Because it is HUGE. made of MEAT. ZOMBIE MEAT. Have you ever tried to attack a wall of zombie meat?
How about a Tree-Trunk sized wall of Zombie Meat being hurled repeatedly into your face?
It is because MASSIVE ENOUGH SIEGE WEAPONS are like Walls themselves when you try to destroy them.
They are relentless, they aren't indestructible, but they have HUGE Defense and HP points. It takes many many whacks with a sword to try to destroy Batterskull. Even setting it on Fire is going to take some effort, no ordinary 3 damage spells can take it out, you need to burn it for 5 at least!
It has Vigilance not because it's a protector of your own lifetotal, so much as it a GIANT, SLAG, OF MEAT, and that means it is very tough, very resilient. AND IT LEAVES A SENSE OF RELENTLESS INEVITABLE DOOM IN A CLOUD AROUND IT AS IT TRAMPS TO YOUR GATES! The feel of having your doors battered and rammed against? Having a Batterskull on the wrong side of the table puts you in the position of getting to know what the Soldiers of Gondor or Peasant Garrisson of Helm's Deep felt like!
if it had Haste, the Return to Hand clause would make more sense: Because you'd be viscerally, THROWING it in your opponent's face, every, turn. :O
GROND! >:O GROND! >:D GROND! >:O GROND! >:D GROND! >:O GROND! >:D GROND! >:O GROND! >:D GROND! >:O GROND! >:D GROND! >:O GROND! >:D GROND! >:O GROND! >:D GROND! >:O GROND! >:D GROND! >:O GROND! >:D GROND! >:O GROND! >:D
This card is pretty much a microcosm of all those good stuff decks that crush my crappy soldiers or elves. Too powerful, too much of a flavour mishmash, and played by people who take the game seriously and aim to win. Not their fault, but mine for missing the point.
Really, Trample is all this card needed. Trample and perhaps the restoration function. Bump the rarity down to Rare, reduce it's absurd and stupid powers, and then we'll talk Wizards. Until then, stop making random ass overpowered artifacts. *coughWurmcoilcough*
In addition, the art is just damned terrible, what the ***, guys? What even is that?
702.24k Phased-out tokens cease to exist as a state-based action.
702.24f When a permanent phases out, any Auras, Equipment, or Fortifications attached to that permanent phase out at the same time. This alternate way of phasing out is known as phasing out "indirectly." An Aura, Equipment, or Fortification that phased out indirectly won't phase in by itself, but instead phases in along with the permanent it's attached to.
702.24b If a permanent phases out, its status changes to "phased out." Except for rules and effects that specifically mention phased-out permanents, a phased-out permanent is treated as though it does not exist. It can't affect or be affected by anything else in the game.
That's right, I didn't just exile your Batterskull... I caused it to no longer exist. For a single blue mana, at instant speed.
Even though your explanations are good, the card could have been changed so that it would be explained more easily. Just because you can explain something doesn't mean it's good design. This card makes no sense. It really is just a bunch of OP keywords tacked onto one card because it's a mythic rare.
As for the card, terrible design. Nothing interesting about it, and the flavour is all off.
Spoken like a TRUE Magic player.
I wish this card gets reprinted one day with new art that corrects the flavor. It could be some kind of Bat/Vampire themed battering ram for example.
Also I see nothing wrong with the art. It's meant to be ugly and scary-looking and it does that well.
Wait, what?
Vigilance probably is implied by the fact that the thing is so huge that even after its attacked it's a bulky defender they're going to have to fight their way through.
As for lifelink, well... if you look at the promo art, it becomes obvious the front of the thing is a mouth. It's eating them.
I do find the self bounce ability bizarre and somewhat unnecessary, though.
Did you really just write that? Being "bulky" means that you're a deft and vigilant defender? People fight "through" battering rams? As a thought exercise, I invite you to consider which side of a seige makes use of battering rams: the attackers or the defenders?
The art that shows "eating" might explain lifelink (although one wonders what sort of lifeforce a battering ram is consuming from eating a castle wall...). OK, I'll sorta, kinda give you that. That still doesn't explain the bouncey-ness.
---------------
Anyone seeing a trend and wonder if Wizards is trolling us with BS cards it knows are broken? BaneSlayer Angel, BlightSteel Colossus, and BatterSkull? Obvious 5/5 uber-play that oozes card advantage...but...
This is just about as badly-designed of a card as I've ever seen. It's transparently broken and none of its abilities make sense from a flavor standpoint.
Vigilance makes ZERO sense for a battering ram. Serra Angels, Elite Inquisitors, Steadfast Guards and such presumably have fast reflexes and take deft swings and thrusts that they recover quickly from to reset their defenses. Why does a battering ram confer this upon the beings wielding it?
The bouncy-ness makes power/card advantage sense (eg, to screw Oblivion Ring--a card I definitely DON'T mind screwing!!!), but is bewildering from a flavor/form standpoint. What's the reasoning? Why does a battering ram so easily escape people who want to smash it or cast a spell on it? If it were so STRONG that it resisted such things, that would be fine, but it metaphorically "dodging" is weird.
I hand-waive lifelink since in fantasy "life-draining weapons" are classic fixtures, but even so, battering rams usually aren't aimed at living things--so why would they be imbued with life-draining magics? Of course, every other thing about this is an even more serious "WTF?"
Compare this card to, say, Boggart Ram-Gang which is also a battering ram and an incredibly strong play, but in-flavor and not broken. If I could retcon Batterskull, I'd lose the vigilance in favor of trample. Obviously we wouldn't want wither for a block that's introduced infect, so maybe haste or deathtouch or something? Then I'd swap the bouncey-ness for shroud (of it, and maybe of the equipped creature too) and balance it out by making the equipped creature unable to block (which makes sense since battering rams aren't defensive).
I like it when I read a card's name, mechanics, see its picture, and the backstory and theory of it just comes out intuitively (regardless of falvor text). That's definitely not the case with this card. Cards like this have the same effect on me that I'd get if I were reading a great novel and then suddenly on page 143, the author decided to break the fourth wall. This thing is the black sheep of the BS family--far more deserving of hate than even Baneslayer and Blightsteel.
-Vigilance: If you're battering down someones gates you're besieging them. There's no way around the obstacle pounding your gates because you're cornered; so you have to fight through it.
-Lifelink: If you're besieging a settlement then you're starving them out; maybe you're raiding the caravans that would bring food to the city or the reverse life-gain is a less-broken way of representing the health of the defenders vs. the attackers (as otherwise it could just sit there and rob you of your life-total without attacking/besieging!)
First, note that the germ is sitting on top, sort of piloting it. If you look along the body, you can see a bunch of legs, but not any real segments. It's got vigilance because it changes forward and then moves backwards to charge again. It doesn't turn.
Someone mentioned that "if no one is there to pick it up, it just gets up and walks around on it's own." Actually, with pretty much every living weapon, if you look at the art closely you can see the germ token sitting in the equipment, piloting it. (in Batterskull he is sitting on the top, right after the plate on top of the "head").
The lifelink comes, perhaps, from the many needles and spikes along the front of Batterskull--draining blood and giving life to the pilot.
That's my opinion, anyway.
To me, it looks like the phyrexians took a Plated Slagwurm, compleated it, and modified it to accept a pilot. When installed, the merged intelligence and digestive track grant a sense of strategy and the capacity to feed on prey.
What's more, the modifications are so extensive that, if the "second brain" is killed, and no other creature is around to jump in, it can retreat and regrow it's second brain, and get back in the fight.
That had to be what they (the design team) were thinking. Beyond that, i got nothing.