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Magic: The Gathering Card Comments Archive

R&D's Secret Lair

Multiverse ID: 73967

R&D's Secret Lair

Comments (82)

mutantman
★★★☆☆ (3.0/5.0) (12 votes)
This is nuts. Try a Fallen Empires Thallid for infinite tokens on turn 2. (Turn 1 with an Elvish Spirit Guide.) Or you could always go with Thorn Thallid. Not to mention Ashnod's Altar and a bunch of other Fallen Empires cards with that templating. An Exodus version of Sonic Burst is another turn-two win.

And that's not even getting into Ashnod's Coupon.

As far as silver-bordered stuff goes, this just might be the most broken of them all.
MasterOfEtherium
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.5/5.0) (26 votes)
What Does This Card Do I Dont Understand The Rules Text At All Someone Pleaz Explain
spoonish
★★★☆☆ (3.6/5.0) (5 votes)
this card basically ignores all changes to rules for each card

so for ashnods coupon, target player gets you target drink ends at that (so you dont have to pay for the drink, as written in the errata)
Ratoly
★★★★☆ (4.5/5.0) (25 votes)
R&D's Secret Lair+Floral Spuzzem+Time Warp=Game Stall. As comprehensive rules define that only a player makes a decision, R&D would make the Spuzzman make a decision, thus it is a player, and Time Warp then gives the Spuzzman a turn, which it wouldn't do anything ever. Thus: Stall for eternity.
spacechaser0001
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.6/5.0) (9 votes)
im with you MasterOfEtherium i dont understand either
Shikadi
★★★☆☆ (3.8/5.0) (4 votes)
With the new exiled zone, could i get an creature removed from game back with living wish?
BinarySpike
★★★★☆ (4.2/5.0) (12 votes)
@Ratoly: What if your name is really Floral Spuzzem though??

Beekhead
★★★★☆ (4.3/5.0) (3 votes)
Another fun combo is to use this with a regeneration from Alpha, Beta, or Revised. For one mana you can regenerate any creature.
A3Kitsune
★★★★☆ (4.8/5.0) (4 votes)
@Shikadi: yes, if the card that "exiled" it used the term "remove from the game". "Exile" still sends cards to the exiled zone. Of course, only cards from M10 and Zendakar have that term, so far, and the specific individual card HAS to be physicly printed as part of either set's run. There is no doubt there are a LOT of other fun or powerful tricks that can be pulled with old card wording. How about this (minor) one: while Lifelink abilitys don't stack, cards printed befor Future Sight don't physicaly SAY Lifelink, so these abilitys are no longer Lifelink, and thus stack with Lifelink.
Also, the old Mono Artifacts. Now, you can use their abilities without tapping them, as many times as you want a turn. This works because this only restores the old wording, it doesn't restore the old rules. So that rule that says Mono Artifacts must be tapped to play their ability? Still as gone as ever.
supershawn
★★★☆☆ (3.2/5.0) (3 votes)
I wonder what the effect is on old cards that say to tap them, think I could get away with just tapping them with my finger?
doitpow
★★★★☆ (4.0/5.0) (3 votes)
Roundabout way to destroy White Ward
Snaxme
★★★★☆ (4.5/5.0) (20 votes)
Ashnod's Coupon

You're welcome.
beefrocks
★★★☆☆ (3.8/5.0) (6 votes)
So does this mean that, when playing with a group, you can use Peer Pressure to control everyone's cards (of chosen card type) if just one opponent has fewer than you?
Zetan
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
Frozen Shade from Alpha/Beta/Revised... does anything even happen when you activate that ability with this card out? =P
MisterMelancholy
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.5/5.0) (3 votes)
I usually don't like cards from the unglued set, but this lets me use Time Vault with Voltaic Key.

5/5 for breaking rules that broke brokenness.
Colossus_of_Darkstee
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
i guess any enchantments from alpha. take Burrow for example. target creature gets mountainwalk, doesnt have to be the enchanted creature.
ivanescalante
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.5/5.0) (2 votes)
With an old Triskelion. Instant win.
littlebeast
★★★★☆ (4.1/5.0) (7 votes)
Play a Revised Desert Twister to get rid of a card you never want to play against again.

@BinarySpike: Then you need to kill your parents.
Mata-nui3
★★★☆☆ (3.0/5.0) (2 votes)
@A3Kitsune: Due to the rulings on wording changes, currently the only "lifelink" card from before Time Spiral that actually changed functionality in the first place is Loxodon Warhammer, because it had already been reprinted to say lifelink. The other cards' wordings and functionality did not change.

@Ratoly: Then your opponent calls a judge to give Floral Spuzzem a game loss for stalling. So, your creature loses the game. XD

...5'd for awesome!
count_dorku
★★★★☆ (4.6/5.0) (18 votes)
"Addictive ink."

I knew it.
Mudbutt_on
★★★★☆ (4.1/5.0) (4 votes)
Hey, here's the way to get back all your old favorite creature types! Oh Uncle Istvan, you're so silly.
Garfunculus
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
Fan-freakin'-tastic.
Polychromatic
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
I don't think anyone can reasonably deny the ridiculous stupidity of this card. And I mean that in the best way.
Kirbster
★★★★☆ (4.8/5.0) (27 votes)
"Play cards as written"?

Gentlemen, I believe we have found the ultimate counter to textless promos.
C5r1a5z0y
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
@ivanescalante: Just make sure you don't use the Antiquities version. Then Triskelion would try to give itself counters while on the stack. And you'd never be able to discard any +1/+1 counters to do the damage (unless you happened to have drawn some ;-)
BlackAlbino
★★★☆☆ (3.0/5.0) (3 votes)
to make the afore mentioned combo with ashnod's coupon a game winner. carry a drink with you, put a modest price tag on it of ohhh, bout $1000, even if they do buy it, you just made $1000! otherwise they'll have to concede
CollectiveC
★★☆☆☆ (2.8/5.0) (2 votes)
This card has plenty of synergies, such as:

Cards like Disrupting Scepter and Icy Manipulator are much better.
Cards like Regeneration and Blessing target any of your creatures.
Orcish Oriflamme cost 1Red instead of its revised 3Red.
Mana Barbs works quite well with something like Mana Short, or the aforementioned Manipulator.
Fork doubles twice.
Cards like Dragon Whelp can be regenerated to stop them from killing themselves.
Cards like Frozen Shade do not lose their bonus.
Nikeyeia
★★★☆☆ (3.6/5.0) (6 votes)
Ancestral Recall.

DRAW THOSE CARDS!! DRAW THEM NOW!!!

On a side note, this is probably the most broken card ever.
MisterAction
★★★★☆ (4.4/5.0) (5 votes)
The old version of lightning bolt "does 3 damage to one target." So you can deal three damage to lands and enchantments now!
Wprundv
★★★★☆ (4.1/5.0) (6 votes)
Wouldn't Floral Spuzzem just lose the game due to trying to draw from an empty library?
AjaniHouse
★★★☆☆ (3.2/5.0) (3 votes)
go ahead; play your Black Lotus. do it, you wont
001010011100101110
★★★☆☆ (3.8/5.0) (8 votes)
Basic Lands no longer do anything. :3
RedAtomsk
★★★★☆ (4.4/5.0) (12 votes)
Play this with Decree of Annihilation, then pull out a butcher's knife from your backpack. "It says I get to remove your hand from the game... would you like to concede now?"
the_nonaffiliated
★★☆☆☆ (2.0/5.0) (4 votes)
progenitus. that's all i need to say
Valencio
★★★★★ (5.0/5.0) (1 vote)
Works especially well with any old cards that simply refer to themselves by type, like Goblin Balloon Brigade, which would now give any Goblins (or perhaps all Goblins) flying until end of turn for only a solitary red mana.
TheNewNo2
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
001010011100101110, you're wrong, only modern basic lands do nothing - old ones which say "Tap: add * to mana pool" will work fine. You know, back from the days when Islands actually looked like proper islands rather than strange things which happen to have a bit of water in them.
BiOhyBr
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
Dark Ascension has made this card a catalyst of human genocide... lookin at you Zombie Apocalypse.
Gako
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
But does it blend?
Iktomi
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
@RedAtomsk
As the active player, your hands are removed first. Make my day.
Destruction3402
★★★☆☆ (3.4/5.0) (7 votes)
Skirsdag Flayer, "Sacrifice a Human"...
Well, there's no humans on the battlefield, I guess that leaves me and my opponent as targets.
Squab
★★★★☆ (4.9/5.0) (14 votes)
Wizards should errata this card and get rid of it's first ability.

Just to screw with us.
DarthParallax
★★★☆☆ (3.4/5.0) (4 votes)
The_nonaffiliated is right. Progenitus is the most powerful card in Magic if you remove all Errata. It has protection from paying its cost, protection from summoning sickness, protection from losing, protection from reading the rulebook, and protection from the Spanish Inquisition.

Because only Progenitus expects the Spanish Inquisition.
EGarrett01
★★★★☆ (4.1/5.0) (7 votes)
@RedAtomsk,

"Play this with Decree of Annihilation, then pull out a butcher's knife from your backpack. "It says I get to remove your hand from the game... would you like to concede now?"

But Decree says to remove ALL hands, and as the active player, don't you have to go first?
rogelio
★★★☆☆ (3.7/5.0) (5 votes)
Zombie Apocalypse? "Destroy all Humans"? Well, the card says so, so I guess I have no choice there. Pardon me as I grab my chainsaw.
Infraclear
★★★☆☆ (3.1/5.0) (4 votes)
Withengar unbound "oops I lost the game; I guess he's twice as strong. Shoot I lost the game again." Or if you're at Fnm or another event where several people are playing, it gets pretty powerful!
Totema
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
If you play this with Rock Hydra, the counters you put on them have to be actual heads. It does not say what they have to be heads of, however.
TheTorq
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
Use with Alpha/Beta lands for more fun
Gameguy602
★★☆☆☆ (2.5/5.0) (2 votes)
Donate an old Icy Manipulator, then Mindslaver, while you control a Vile Bile. Proceed to make your opponent physically tap the bile as many times as they have mana.

Speaking of mindslaver, the newest one gives you control of target player during their turn. Think about it, you now have control of a player, and they aren't an instant or sorcery, so you can argue that they are a permanent. You just need to use Rishadan Pawn Shop while they are under your control to shuffle them into their own deck.
deathbyminions
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.8/5.0) (2 votes)
Very good card, although I still don't get exactly how it works. Is the only card affected by this Ashnod's Coupon?? because it actually says the 'eratta' on it? Or is that as long as its on the field, you can play any card without playing its mana cost, and 'play all cards as written' and only use their abilities?
KnexWiz
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.5/5.0) (1 vote)
this should be in ftv:r
RuscoJames
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
@Black Albino
Only the errata on Ashnod's Coupon mentions anything about buying a drink. If you R&D secret lair that errata away, the player doesn't have to buy the drink. They are just required to get it for you. The method of acquisition isn't specified. They could just take the drink you placed on the table and give it back to you.

Edit: Actually the errata doesn't even specify that it must be purchased. You just have to pay any costs for it, which might imply buying, but still doesn't require it.
BongRipper420
★★☆☆☆ (2.8/5.0) (4 votes)
Progenitus can be played turn 1 one with this, because it has protection from rules.
CorkBulb
★★☆☆☆ (2.8/5.0) (6 votes)
I just happen to be a rules lawyer that will defend the official comprehensive rules to the death. However, the first question I ask when I take on a case is "does this involve R&D's Secret Lair?" Those are the only cases I will not take.

This card is the essence of rules chaos in Magic: The Gathering, however, as a rules lawyer, I am compelled to remind all of you what Mark Rosewater said himself in the FAQTIWDAWCC (Frequently Asked Questions That If We Didn't Answer Would Cause Chaos (http://www.wizards.com/magic/tcg/article.aspx?x=magic/faq/unhinged))

" Remember kids, the law trumps all _Magic_ rules"
"The rules don't allow you to touch other players without their permission. Okay, it's not actually the rules, it's the law."

So, chopping somebody's hand off with a butcher's knife or murdering them with a chainsaw, would, according to Rosewater, be against the rules because it's against the law XD

I hope this ruins everybody's fun ;)

5/5
scipio323
★★★★☆ (4.1/5.0) (5 votes)
This with Boil: Sorry about that Madagascar, no one really liked you anyway.
Kurraga
★★☆☆☆ (2.5/5.0) (2 votes)
This still works with "comes into play" effects, and "remove from the game" effects exile cards

403.5. Previously, the battlefield was called the "in-play zone." Cards that were printed with text that contains the phrases "in play," "from play," "into play," or the like are referring to the battlefield. Cards that were printed with that text have received errata in the Oracle card reference.

406.7. Previously, the exile zone was called the "removed-from-the-game zone." Cards that were printed with text that "removes from the game" exiles that object. The same is true for cards printed with text that "sets aside." Cards that were printed with that text have received errata in the Oracle card reference.
sarroth
★★★☆☆ (3.2/5.0) (10 votes)
I enjoy this card because you have to know Magic well enough not to completely play the game wrong. Half of the examples on this comments thread are people trying to alter rules of the game, not errata. I even thought this before when I jumped on the Progenitus and this card bandwaggon. Progenitus doesn't actually change, because what "protection from everything" means is defined by the rules, specifically 702.15i. Protection from everything is not defined by errata and is thus not affected by this card. Auras target when the thing they're enchanting when they're on the stack about the enchant them, their target cannot be made anything else; again, part of the rules, not the errata.

However, their are plenty of cards which are probably messed up by this card, such as basic lands when printed without the supertype Basic, legendary creatures are probably no longer affected by the legend rule, Frozen Shade's early versions probably get a permanent pump, etc. Floral Spuzzem's ability probably just fizzles; otherwise, it probably results in a draw given that the choice can never be made and would go to time. I'm not exactly sure how creatures with "Summon" instead of the creature type work; they probably don't have summoning sickness, probably can't be targeted by anything that would target creatures, probably can't be used by anything that doesn't target but uses creatures (e.g., convoke), and may not even be able to attack since only creatures can attack. Any talk of Floral Spuzzem being a player that could be targeted by things which target players frankly doesn't make any sense.
James00086
★★★★☆ (4.9/5.0) (7 votes)
@scipio323 By that logic we should really be concerned about Zombie Apocalypse. Specifically the last part.
TheWrathofShane
★★★★★ (5.0/5.0) (4 votes)
This + Zodiac Dragon.
azure_drake222222
★★★★★ (5.0/5.0) (3 votes)
This card is unlinkable. It links to "R". Try it here: R&D's Secret Lair
Lifegainwithbite
★★★☆☆ (3.5/5.0) (3 votes)
@sarroth: You must be fun at parties.
StudentOfEtherium
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.5/5.0) (1 vote)
Lol. Play Blood Tyrant. If You Play The Game, He Gets Super Huge
slathbog3000
★★★★★ (5.0/5.0) (4 votes)
I think I found a way to link this
Belgarath123
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.5/5.0) (2 votes)
With this, you can keep Venser, the Sojourner's emblem for the rest of your games!
Lord_of_Gelectrodes
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.5/5.0) (1 vote)
How to be a royal a$$:
"Oh, you forgot your deck?
So sorry about that, want to borrow mine?"
*sneaks brand into library*
adrian.malacoda
★★★★★ (5.0/5.0) (6 votes)
People seem to think this card just lets you re-interpret the wording of cards willy-nilly.

How on earth would this interact at all with Venser, the Sojourner? Venser hasn't even been errated.

Why would anyone think this changes the meaning of game terms like "own" or "exile"?
EdgarPoeAllen
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.5/5.0) (2 votes)
Cards that say tap whatever now make you tap it. With your finger.
S-r-ex
★★★☆☆ (3.5/5.0) (3 votes)
Why do people think this is cool with Progenitus?

Protection from everything.

Everything?

He'll have protection from you as well, so you can't order him to attack or block or otherwise interact with him. Ditto your opponent.

Everything!

Protection from instants and sorceries. Protections from random. Protection from himself. Protection from his own abilities. Protection from infinite loops. Protection from the rules. Protection from probability. Protection from past, future and present. Protection from logic. Protection from existence, nonexistence and the following quantum state. Protection from 42. Name it, imagine it, dream it, he has protection from it.

EVERYTHING!

Protection from MaRo.
MrMilosz
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
@TheWrathOfShane: No guarantees, but perhaps a little HTML entity encoding might do the trick?

R&D's Secret Lair

Or, if that doesn't work, perhaps some URL encoding?

R%26D's Secret Lair

Either way, even if it works it's ugly as sin.
Nucleon
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
I should put this into an EDH deck just to guarantee instant comedy.

"Welp, the card says we all lose one life. Do we have to concede now, or does the game expect us to hang ourselves?"
Pyleic
★★★★★ (5.0/5.0) (1 vote)
@S-r-ex
Protection from Everything never got errata'd. Look at Progenitus on Gatherer. It still says "Protection from everything". "Everything" was clarified to mean "Progenitus can't be blocked, Progenitus can't be enchanted or equipped, Progenitus can't be the target of spells or abilities, and all damage that would be dealt to Progenitus is prevented." but that's not errata, that's just defining the rules.

If this card prevented that, it would also prevent any card without reminder text after its keyword from having an ability. Heck, it'd render literally every part of a card non-valid, because none of it makes sense in a vaccuum.

Errata, in the context of MTG, is strictly defined as alterations made to a card after it's gone to print, either for clarity, or because something was broken that they didn't catch. Wormfang Crab is a perfect example; playtesting didn't catch that, if you controlled no creatures and played Wormfang Crab, the game was an instant stalemate, so it was errata'd to fix that.
OstravaBoletaria
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
Apocalypse Chime... fetch yer shovels!
Mirrordin_Pure
★★★★★ (5.0/5.0) (3 votes)
It's such a beauty that this one has never been errata'd.
Now then, I'm off to go make 0/0 tokens with Marath, Will of the Wild.
car2n
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
As a chaotic-neutral troll, this is one of my favorite cards in the entire game.
casual_melvin
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
Ignore all errata is pretty clear.

Play cards as written could be interpreted as ignoring the entire comprehensive rules as well, but since that either grinds the game to a complete halt with no way to play lands, cast spells, attack, block, place activated or triggered abilities on the stack or even pass priority: OR it turns magic into calvinball, where anything goes,


It makes much more sense that "play cards as written" means to still follow everything in the comprehensive rules except rules that are directly contradicted by the non-oracle text of cards.


Edit:

a more interesting way of interpreting "play all cards as written is that players have to write down which land they wish to play, which cards they want to cast, which abilities they choose to activate, which cards they choose as targets and which creatures will attack or block for them each turn.
Jeri
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
"I play Wrath of god" (4th edition)
*Player dresses up and grabs a shovel*
yuvalg
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
I can't believe no one has mentioned Decree of Annihilation.
"Remove all hands from the game" = everyone has to use their feet
yousquiddinme
★★☆☆☆ (2.8/5.0) (2 votes)
You can't just..you can't just change the rules. A hand, in magic terms, is a hand full of cards, not a physical hand.

There are a lot of cool interactions with this card that people are ignoring because 'with progenitus you can't touch him c:' and that's wrong.
Ansem717
☆☆☆☆☆ (0.0/5.0)
One of the best lands in the game. Here's the real use behind it.

Have R&D's Secret Lair in play. Call a judge over, and challenge him to a game of Rock, Paper, Scissors. Now he is a player. Play True-Name Nemesis and name the Judge. TNN has Protection from that Judge. Then use any of the multitude of cards which allow you to alter card types, and use it to change the creature type of TNN from Creature to Planeswalkers. Since players are Planeswalkers, TNN is theoretically a Player. However, it's a 1v1 not a 2v1. Therefore, you can request to have the other player continue for you. Now a TNN who is protected from a judge is playing against your opponent. Since TNN needs assitance, you can perform the necessary actions to help TNN play the game. You can also advertise that you're the only one who can hear TNN's silent talking, so only you can do it, and TNN is telling you to cheat. Since he's protected from that judge, he can't be called out for cheating, or illegal game states.

You may proceed to assist True-Name Nemesis to cheat because he's protection from Judge. Also, since it's an unhindged tournament, this will probably be allowed.

Have fun.